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My name is Nori Guthrie from the Woodson Research Center Found and Library at Rice University. I am interviewing Sharon Matthews. Today is June 28th, 2018. This is part of the Houston Folk Music Archive, oral History project. Can you tell me about your early life? Yes, I

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can. Well, I started out on Long Island, New York and my sisters, uh Lynn Ler and Elaine Ster went to Houston and they got in the folk business, well, in the restaurant business at Anderson Fair with the Marvin Anderson and Gray Fair. And I loved my

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sisters dearly that, you know, they came in and, um, when I was 11 years old, my sister, Elaine and Pat Stout came in and got me so excited about the music. And so my, uh, uh, my whole visit to, uh Houston was when I was 12

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years old and I went to Anderson Fair and saw the magic that my sisters were involved in. I went to their apartment on West Gray and, and, you know, met a lot of people, but I was with my parents. And so over the years I would

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write to my sister and my sister would say, well, you should come, you should come. I'm dating Tim Leatherwood and he's got a job at Herman Park and he can get you to work at the zoo. So I said, oh my God, dream job, yay. So

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I got on the bus with my friend Kay Lane and took the Greyhound bus to Houston. But by that time I got there, Lynn broke up with Tim and was going out with Bill Cade and he was at the bus stop waiting for us and, and

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as soon as we got off, the bus is, oh, burly man comes over, he goes, you must be Sharon and I looked up at him and I said, here I am, he goes get in a van, you know. Oh, best ride I ever took. So he

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took me to, to my sister's house where we lived right around the corner and from uh Hoolihan on West Timer. And, um, we went to Anderson Fair and I felt like I had the golden ticket because I got in and I got the VIP pass to

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where I got backstage. And right then everybody was just starting out. Lyle Lovett, um Lucinda Vince Bell, Nancy Griffith, um Eric Taylor, um, Don Sanders and, uh, you know, immediately. Oh, Sharon Ster. So you're gonna work at the fair. And then so yes, I got in,

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uh, at the fair and Walter Spinks and, um, and Steve Baker were managing Hooli Hands on West Timer and they, they gave me a job there. And so I had doubled the music, you know, working at Anderson Fair and working at, at Hooli Hands. We had

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the best acts in the world come through. It was amazing. So that was my start of it was 1978 1978. Ok. Um, can you talk a little bit more specifically about the scene? The music scene was incredible and to watch it all start and to be

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a part of it and be in the late night and the beginning of it, the, you know, starting out the evening and seeing people come in, I mean, it was, it was incredible to be in part of this folk generation that were amazing writers. The lyrics

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would grab you, make you wanna cry, make you wanna laugh, make you, you know, like Lucinda's album, I was involved on her first album. I was so excited to know who was a part of every song and she would break down everything because, you know, we

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were there recording with her and Rex was in the band, Andre Matthews was in the band. Mickey was in the band, Mickey White. Um uh Malcolm Smith was in the band, um A lot of people and just being a part and knowing where the songs come

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from, you know, it's, it really does uh bring a full circle to everything. Yes. Do you want to tell any specific stories about any of the musicians. Well, everyone accepted me like a little sister and I was grateful for that because I truly, um, I, my

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sister Lynn, who was 13 years older than me and my sister Elaine, who was 11 years older than me. They really, um, they were so into the music. Lynn knew every lyric to Eric Taylor's stuff and Vince Bell, I mean, and then the whole choir would

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sing to Bill Stays and Roger Ruffcorn was working at KPFT. So, you know, he would have some of the musicians go down there and then a whole bunch of crowd people would go into so we could sing along. It was, it was magical and everybody felt,

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felt the magic. It just wasn't one person, it was everybody, everybody was included. And back then, you know, you had a crowd. I mean, you could get a ton of people out. Everybody was so willing to be a part. It was beautiful. Um Maybe we could

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focus on some specific people. So, um you were talking about um Don Sanders, what were some of your interactions with him? Don Sanders was um a very gentle, sweet man with just incredible songwriting lyrics that would, would grab you. Um He was generous with his love,

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sweet love, you know, just um and um kind and later on in life, he came and played uh my venue at the Oaks in, in um Austin for me. He went to teach in, you know, so we, with mostly all of the people we kept a

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relationship over the years and it's a long time, you know, relationships. Richard Dobson, you know, I really got to learn how to play guitar, learning Richard Dobson songs. Bill Cade helped me find my guitar. I mean, Linda Lowe and Tim Leatherwood sat there and taught me

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how to play guitar and taught me on one of Linda's songs and we play it over and over and over and it was just um indebted to her for Life Candle in the Sky. Yes. When did you pick up the guitar in 1978? And so we

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would start picking parties because I lived right across the street from Holihan. And um, you know, then, then I started dating and I got married to Rex in that house and we still just had a room but everybody came in and a large room downstairs in

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the house that everybody would come and we have uh picking parties and, uh, you know, because the party never ended when you're that young. I mean, you don't get tired of two, you know, you want it to go on forever and it seemed like those parties

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never ended. Oh, yes. Um Who were some people that would come over for those? A lot of people, a lot of people. Um uh let's see, uh Steve Baker and Walter Spas and Francy files, Gerard and Bill Cade and Richard Dobson and Mickey White and Rex.

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And, um, let's see, um, Johnny Guest when we moved out, when Rex and I moved out to other houses, we had other people that would come towns and every time that he came into town, you know, um, uh, and he had his entourage and, and, um,

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let me see, uh, can't think of any Nancy. You know, it was, she didn't come to the West Timer house. No, she didn't. She was the one. She played uh Huli Hands a lot. Her and Eric and uh you know, but didn't come over to the

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PIC and parties after that. Um Are there any experiences from being at Anderson Fair that really stand out to you? There's so many because, you know, I had the golden ticket and so I could, we had meals and, and love and shared, shared um, birthdays which

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I'm the birthday queen. I love birthdays and I still call, I still call and I, now I sing rex song. You know, you're a grand old man. You're a high flying bag and your spare tires added spare over, you're under rate. You're living in total despair.

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But it's your birthday and we decided to say that we love you anyway. May old acquaintance wish you well to nori on your birthday, not your birthday. But um there's something that you said in there. Um, oh, food. Did you work on preparing the food? The

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spaghetti. Oh, Yes. Yes. Taxi Tom gave me $1000. It seemed like that was so much money and so Cathy Slane and I got to be the spaghetti mamas with our $1000 that we put down. It goes fast. But I didn't realize that I thought it would

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last forever. But it doesn't, you know, but that was the joy of, you know, uh, being at the spaghetti lunches is because Smith and, and Malcolm Smith and, um, you know, uh, people would come down there and play and it was phenomenal. Yes. And, um, Connie

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Mims and lots of people would come down and, and play the lunches and, you know, and work for spaghetti. Do you? I, I've been wondering, do, do you remember the recipe? Francy? Does Franci has the recipe down? But, you know, it was a vegetarian, uh, recipe

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with fennel in there and, and, uh, squash and then, you know, the meat based one. And so it was nice that you had a choice because you had vegetarians. Yes. Ok. Then I will, I will see if I can try to ask Clancy and I, matter

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of fact, I know that I can get you the recipe. Ok. Because that would be a really awesome thing to be able to, to have archival because it is such an important aspect. Yes, it is. Yes. Yes. We all make spaghetti 1000 different ways now because

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I have a garden and it's whatever comes out of that garden goes in, um, can you, um, describe the interior of Anderson Fair when you arrived there? Well, when I arrived there, it wasn't like anything. Now, you know, it was that one room and the people

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played up in the, up in the front of it and there were tables, you know, but, and then they had the kitchen, they, you know, it was, it was small and, you know, they had the other room but, um, it was, it was, they expanded it

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out and, and, you know, put in the bar and everything and, and they didn't have that at the time and I have lots of pictures of that I brought in the trunk load of pictures so you can see and they will be in the archives of

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those pictures. Great, um, around. So this was when you first visited in the early seventies compared to the 78 was for me, my sisters were early earlier. Ok. So in 78 they were still just using the kind of the small long room. Ok. All right. No,

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that's, that's good to know. Um, because there wasn't yet the stage or was there a stage kind of built in there? You know, I can't remember. I'm trying to think of the stage was, I can't remember. Ok. Right now, that's ok. No. All right. Um, can

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you talk of, you also worked at number two? Um, can you talk about that venue? Well, John Toomey owned the place and Pam ran it for him and, uh, they love music. They absolutely adored music and they let whoever manage it, run it and, you know,

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all these phenomenal musicians would come in, you know, and all different styles and served hamburgers. And that's where I met, uh, I met, um, Andre and Andre met me as I was working behind the, um, the counter and he saw me and I had pig tails,

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you know, and, and, uh, running the show, you've got a hamburger and you want a beer, OK. Everybody just hold on. We're gonna get it to you, you know, just, and he liked my energy. And so that's when he really, you know, said that that was

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the start of our relationship, you know, because he saw me back there, but it took him seven years to get me because I married Rex, you know, and, and that was a wonderful, wonderful relationship too, you know, and we're still good friends and wonderful friends. Um,

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were there other venues that you went to in that during that time period? I mainly hung out with the Both Anderson Fair and uh Hoolihan's. But if, uh Bill Cade and Stephen were playing theaters, I would go there with Shake Russell over at Cory's. I would

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go there. I worked at Fitzgerald's with Sarah Fitzgerald's and, and then we, we got to dance all night long and I love the music that she, she brought in there too. It was phenomenal. And, um, and there was another place, uh Laga, you know, we would

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go over there and, um, so, and you know what, a lot of the people did the same places and, and I was part of the crowd. So I followed them, you know, and I was the fan. Can you talk about La Bodega? Can you remember? Like,

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what did it look like? Oh God. All right. Um It was a downstairs and upstairs and the downstairs was the stage. Ok. And um, the bar, the big long bar and I know Tom Cranston worked there at serving food and, um, during the seventies, 78 in

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there and uh it was comfortable, everybody was comfortable. That's the, you know, it was just a real nice place to go to play, to hear music, get something good to eat and, you know, then head out after that. All right. Um, and you said that you

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also worked, um, spent some time working at Fitzgerald's Fitzgerald's and Corky's. Yes. And, um, I, I absolutely love the places. I love Fitzgerald's because I love the dance floor and I love Doctor Rocket. You know, Herschel be, I mean, I am fans Sean Walter, I'm a

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huge fan. I could dance all night long. I, you know, and they, they had phenomenal acts in there and, and, um, and, uh, you know, with drinks and they hardly have any tables. So you gotta dance, you know, and it was fun. It was just a

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lot of fun. What was like on the inside. Um, downstairs there were pool tables in a bar and, you know, people would mingle down there if the upstairs was closed. You know, it wasn't a show happening. You go downstairs and I would play pool and, you

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know, have 75 drinks just, but I would have drinks down there and, you know, uh, uh, the Friday, you know, Friday, Saturday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, you know, upstairs was happening. The brothers, they would come in and do their thing too with the, you know, acts and

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those, those guys were so much fun. Everybody was being, um, creative was the, um, the upstairs. Um, so most of that was a dance floor, just a, a bar, a little bar, a little, couple, few, few tables and then the big gigantic stage and, you know,

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they, some chairs, some tables in, in, in there too. But I love the dance floor. Did you? Uh, so the, the interior that was that kind of similar in size to Rockefellers. The same kind of amount of people would go similar. Yeah, Rockefellers was nicer. I

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worked Rockefellers too. I did. Well, you know what, why not? Why not? I got tired of one and moved on to the other. I was young. I could do anything. I was invincible. You know, I still think I'm invincible at 59. I'm still, you know, it's

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a little bit slower but, you know, still going. Yeah. And, uh, uh Rockefellers was, uh, you know, like people would come in there, see top and, you know, you know, Kingston Trio, I mean, you know, it was amazing the music, uh, all the places they were,

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it was really amazing. Love the blues that, um, had Fitzgerald's. And, uh, you know, Fitzgerald's was more um relaxed and, um, uh rock fellas was a little nicer. It cost a little bit more, but, you know, being upstairs and sitting on one of the tables and

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watching the act down there, you felt like the Royals. Ok. So there was seating up above and then there's a stage, I've been told that there was a, the green room was kind of uh the bank vault. So you, that was right kind of behind the

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stage. Yes. Yes. Beautiful, beautiful and, and one of my friends, Deborah Bauer's daughter had her wedding there and it was amazing. It was gorgeous. And then you, you also mentioned working for Yes. Yes. Um Could you talk a little bit more about that? Um uh You

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know what? I had fun with, um, my girlfriends, Cathy Slane, sister Pat Slane worked with me there and we'd worked the same shifts. It was, you know, it's a short time. But, you know, uh Dana Cooper and, and um, and John Van Der and, and Shake

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Russell and, you know, spectacular acts and, you know, we had free drinks there a lot. So because we were young and cute, you know, and you, and you weren't young and cute. It attracts anybody, right. Um, and, uh, so, uh, we, we, uh, smaller way, smaller

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venue but intimate, intimate, it's like, er, people were quiet there and respectful and listen, like Anderson Fair. You cannot talk. I've gotten in trouble in there because I'm a, you know, or taking pictures, you know, I love taking pictures and not taking pictures. Yes. II, I

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was told by one person that, um, they were, they were known for their, they were making a lot of frozen drinks. Love them. Oh my God. I love, I mean, I even had in my trunk and my car set up. I would just stop and get

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ice and just, you know, for the after party or the beginning party or just in case anybody wanted a pina colada, I had it. Um, if you're kind of thinking about all those different venues, the ones that you worked at or ones that you went to,

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um, what would you say was your favorite? Of course Anderson Fair. Anderson Fair. That was my home. That's where I grew up. That's where I really got my education. People were so generous and kind to me because of my sisters, you know, that they work the,

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uh, spaghetti lunches. My brother baked bread at the spaghetti lunches. You know, that was Tim always made me feel comfortable. I, I dated Roger Rough Corn for a while and, um, you know, while he was running it and, uh, we had all of our funerals there,

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you know. And so we were, you know, good and bad times we'd go in the back rooms and, you know, a lot was said and a lot were, a lot of our future was planned in the back rooms. I remember at Roger's funeral, I was sitting

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in the back with Dale so far and I, I was really good friends with Dale so far because of Rex. And, um, and, uh, Dale said to me, he goes, Sharon, listen, this is what we gotta do. Um, when we get old, we need a community

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so we could all have a big community room that we could have the music, we could have artwork going on. We'll have a wood shop that, you know, Doug Dori and Jack Farrell and all those guys can build. We all got rooms in a huge so

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we can make spaghetti you need, you know, and I wound up that I did that, you know, I did that in my community, um, in, in so, you know, very lucky. But it was Dale's idea that really made me think. You know what, Dale? You're so

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right. You're so right. You know, and Dale was a, a great friend, a really great friend and we did many, many wonderful things together. Can we go back to Roger Corn? Can you talk a little bit more about them? He, he's mentioned many people have mentioned

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him and mentioned he was on the radio but I haven't had any like, really good stories about him. Oh, he was the salt of the earth. He was kind, he was generous. He smoked cigarettes and loved reading the paper in the morning. You know, he was,

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he loved music, he loved musicians, he loved trying to set up, you know, maybe you can play here, play at hands, you know, get on KPFT. He would always try to think, you know, let me give you a couple days so I can fill it in

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and make it worth your while. He was always generous to everybody. He always had a smile and at Anderson Fair, you could bring in your dog and, you know, dogs in there and I can't think of his dog's name right now. But, um, he always had,

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it was a doberman pincher, you know, it scared me a little bit. But, you know, um, and he had beautiful son and, uh, he was, he, we stayed strong in our relationship all the way to the day. He died, you know, with everybody the years go

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by. But our relationship from our foundation from Anderson Fair, you know, really set the tone. You know, I still talk to a lot of the people like Andres 70th birthday is coming up a lot of the people are coming, you know, a lot of the, the

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old friends and I appreciate it because half of my friends are on the other side. There's a great darn band and folk music and songwriting and food on the other side. Yeah. And then can you talk a little bit about Dale? Um, and Dale was a

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wonderful man. He had wonderful women and he always had parties and he had a hot tub and, you know, he would, he would, um he would be gracious to invite people over with cocktails and, you know, and, and, um, and he would make all the gigs

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too. He would make a lot of the gigs that were important. He was always there for Rex. He really, he cared deeply for Rex. And so, um we would have that bond where he'd come to us at our house. And, um, so, you know, he and

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his entourage, who with whoever that was, we would, it would always be a good time. We were not going to sit around and do nothing, you know, we always had something to do. Um So how long did you end up staying in Houston? Up until the

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eighties? Uh Yes, up until the eighties. Um I worked at um at the uh Houston, I can't think of the name now. The, where the Houston Rockets have the tunnel over in the country club. I worked at the country club and I can't think of the

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name right now. But, um, you know, uh, in 85 I got pregnant and, um, so I stayed with the same company and moved to the Austin Creek country club and moved up there and then got pregnant with Andres and my first child, my pride and Joy,

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Ray Andre Matthews and, um, raised him in Austin for only until he was 2.5 because Andre got a position at UCL A. So then we went out to California after that started our, my really, my musical career out in, in, in California. Ok. And what, what

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year was that? That was, um, uh, 89 we moved to California. Yes. And then when my son joined in kindergarten, of course, you know, get on the team. So PT A. Ok. Uh, treasurer executive, you know, um, II I got on the board and, and, uh,

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you know, they asked, they were having carnivals and asked me to, uh, play and I was just like, well, I only played in the closet. I'm really good in the closet. They said, oh, it's ok, you'll just play to some kids. And by the time I

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got home the next day they said we're building you a stage, renting you A PP A, how many people are in your band? And I was like, oh my God. So I got on the Lord and I just said, Andre get who you can from UCL

00:29:41.680 - 00:29:58.550

A and I'm gonna go down to the end of the block and see if Annie Wardlow will be our blues singer. And as we played that one thing and it ended up for years from one gig, people would say, please, can you play my anniversary party,

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please? Can you play this joint every time we played, people would come up and say you're too much fun. Who can you play our party? And so I never had to look, it was, was just handed, it was just a blessing. And that was, was that

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primarily during your time in Los Angeles? We played all over California and we played in, you know, um, all Hollywood and, uh, uh, all right, Huntington, Long Beach, Seal Beach, Hermosa Beach. Um, Laguna Noel. We played in, um, um, going the other way. Come on. Um,

00:30:46.180 - 00:31:09.709

yeah. No. Right. Santa Monica all up and down there, we played in Torrance all the time and one gig went to another. Yes, it was amazing. Did you, um, did you guys do cover songs or write your own material or? Well, I only did Richard Dobson

00:31:09.719 - 00:31:31.510

and Lucinda songs. That's it. I was like that was, and then I wrote my own, starting in 2003. I started writing my own and with a partner, Jocelyn Call and we started another band because it wasn't the Roadkill band. It was, uh, Sharon and Josh. Then

00:31:31.520 - 00:31:48.219

we went into, um, we went into Bender Highway and then we had this bass player, that symphony bass player and he played on the cruise ships. He could walk in and play anything. And he was married to us because we had beautiful women following us. He

00:31:48.229 - 00:32:05.630

was like, I'll do it, I'll do it for free. Eric Burkey. And he would fly to Texas with us because we would come back every year to go to spring fling or party. And, you know, we, and then we started bringing the entourage with us. Rick

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Densmore at um, Rick Densmore, uh loved Andre. I absolutely adored Andre. He loved his guitar playing. He would come and when we were playing with Bandara Highway and just sit there at the, at the on the speaker and just watch Andre all of a sudden one

00:32:27.849 - 00:32:50.469

day he noticed Jos and I swear to God while we were playing, I noticed him come and walk over and he never left. He said that he fell in love and married now, I mean, fell in love and actually they moved, they moved to Texas two

00:32:50.479 - 00:33:05.670

weeks after we did, we sold our house and then they came here and we had the time of our life. Jocelyn and I were so great. I taught her how to play guitar. I mean, but we were so we were on a writing role and when

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we would, I would, uh I would like, uh get gigs and we'd play the Anderson Fair. We do go to, um, to Galveston and play, um, the Old Quarter and then we'd, um, there was an, if we would, we, we would go and play, uh, Francis

00:33:24.589 - 00:33:43.959

party in, in Austin. So, like one of the trips I was before Rick. But, um, but, uh, we wrote six songs on the road writing, you know, just writing, writing. Right. And they, a lot of the songs were about her boyfriend, then Alan Stewart and then

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she was so in love with him and he passed on too. And, but we, we have 10, 12, maybe 14 songs about him and they're all fun, good loving songs. They're great songs and you'll see him on some of those CD si I sent you um

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we didn't end up because I wasn't sure exactly when California happened. So if we 19 9, so if we go back, um you, you were, you were one of the first wives that I've interviewed and like where you were, you know, you were kind of on

00:34:28.540 - 00:34:46.870

the, you were part of it, but kind of on the outside looking in. And so when you were with Rex Bell, what, what was that like? Kind of being a kind of watching everything. Well, I am a motivator and so I would get people to come

00:34:46.879 - 00:35:01.049

to the gigs because at that time, you'd have to either call or send out flyers, you know. And so I was the one saying, hey, you have to come, come on, come on, you can get in the car with us. Come on, come on. You know,

00:35:01.059 - 00:35:18.110

and so I would get people there and Rex loved that about me. It was, you know, I, and so does Andre, because the Andre needed me for that part too. Both of them and um, and, uh, I would get dancers on the floor and, and, and

00:35:18.120 - 00:35:34.750

meet all the strangers and then those strangers I love you become part of it. Part of the show. We're all part of the show with Rex. It was so funny, you know, Rex, when he did the just Mickey and Rex show, you know, we had, he

00:35:34.760 - 00:35:50.945

had Puff and I had Jesse two dogs and then we had a duck and he would put the duck on the air and do a whole comedy routine with the duck and, you know, uh, and the dogs too, the dogs would play the part, everybody was

00:35:50.955 - 00:36:14.739

trained even me pass the tip jar. Now, you know, I mean, and everybody loved the act. It was funny, hysterical, really funny. And, uh, so I was, uh, a, uh, a help with getting people there and making the crowd enjoy the act. Did you work on

00:36:14.750 - 00:36:31.889

the mail? Of course, I, you know, I helped. Can you talk about that? Well, the boys would do all the writing and, you know, Rex used to always hold a little, um, you know, uh, uh, pad and write down jokes and he would, he would work

00:36:31.899 - 00:36:48.179

them out with Bruce Henry Davis. He would send jokes back and forth because Bruce, with the brothers was using jokes too. And, uh, and they like playing off each other. And Bruce, we used to drive to anywhere, you know, and it didn't matter where it was,

00:36:48.189 - 00:37:15.889

he would get a convertible and come on in with his glasses. He was real cool, you know. and, and uh a great supporter. Yes. Um So you the, I didn't catch the year that you ended up leaving Houston for Austin before California. That was about 80

00:37:16.219 - 00:37:35.739

85 86. Yes. Yes, we come back a whole lot. Andre. Andre. Um, when we got to Austin, you know, he was supposed to play a gig with Sean Walters when we first got there, right? This big, big gigantic party out in the middle of the cows.

00:37:35.949 - 00:37:52.989

There was, I mean, you drove to, it was, it was, you know, in, um, in Bastrop, but it just seemed like there was nothing there. And, um, you know, we Sean got a bigger paying gig in Houston. So we called Andre and said, listen, I'm not

00:37:53.000 - 00:38:06.060

gonna make that gig, buddy, you know, go to the party. Anyway, let me call the people and tell them, you know, you should go to the party and meet these people. You just moved to Austin, right? And I was pregnant. I was so pregnant with my

00:38:06.070 - 00:38:23.870

son Ray and, but we said, yeah, they called us Bright and Sherry uh called us and said, yes, please come. So we drove all the way out there and uh we're walking in with a crock pot full of spaghetti. And um and uh and uh you

00:38:23.879 - 00:38:40.949

know, we're walking and Andre's holding the crockpot and all of a sudden he sees this guy and he goes, oh my God, oh my God. And he puts down the button. I'm looking at him and say he goes, Charlie Heinen. It was a guy that he

00:38:40.959 - 00:38:59.909

started a band with when he was 16 years old in Kansas, the first band he's ever been in. And, you know, Charlie is, what are you doing here in the middle of, you know, the cows? And, um, and Andre said, well, my band canceled. He goes,

00:38:59.919 - 00:39:17.469

I'm on next. He goes, I'll go talk to my band later. Your chops still up. And Andre said, holy shit. Yeah. And so he played Donnie Green's band. It was second time around. Don and Green said, ok, Charlie, you know, you're the lead guitar player, you

00:39:17.479 - 00:39:34.560

wanna give him in for your licks. And they were so opposite, you know, Andre never plays the same thing twice. Charlie played it to the tape off the record, you know, he was like the one note for note, you know, and Andre is like, you know,

00:39:34.580 - 00:39:55.139

he played brilliantly all around it all around and then they would both get off playing to each other. Same with, same with, um, with Mickey and Andre, those two would play, they get off the plane, you know, they throw each other licks back. I mean, you

00:39:55.149 - 00:40:12.389

know, you take it and then you take it, they go back and forth and it was brilliant. It was absolutely brilliant. You'd never hear a bad note. That's the amazing thing because with, well, I listen to other guitar players and I'm like, oh, boy, you know,

00:40:12.399 - 00:40:41.199

you could hear the bad note, you never hear the wrong note. It was, he's brilliant. Both of them, all of them. Hm. Um, leaving in that period of 85 86 during that, so from 78 to 85 86 did you see a change in the Houston folk

00:40:41.209 - 00:41:04.689

scene? People would pass on new people would come on, you know, that's the way the game works and you leave a legacy, you know, with, um, with what you wrote and, you know, and, and if you were a big performer, if somebody played your music, that

00:41:04.699 - 00:41:21.939

was the biggest honor that you could get. Of course, there was just a constant flow of new music as it should be. And now, you know, look at all of the bands that are out there. You, I can't keep up now. I can't, it's too much.

00:41:21.949 - 00:41:41.149

I can't, I don't have enough money to go to those places. I don't have enough time. I need 17 drivers to get to all those places. This is just, is, is, it was a magical time because it was so small and so, you know, um unique

00:41:41.159 - 00:42:04.050

with, you know, John Carrick, you know, all those, the, the ringer band like Edwards and all the Andy King bands. He played Lightnin Hopkins as Rex did to Billy Joe Schafer, you know, and he played with Lucinda too, you know, I mean, all those people they

00:42:04.060 - 00:42:24.500

seem to, you know, one fades out, another comes in and was always a, a good player if you guys ended up leaving in that 85 86 period, which is about the time that the scene started to the scene that, you know, all this homegrown talent kind

00:42:24.510 - 00:42:45.229

of started to shrink and smaller and smaller. Yes. Yeah. And so I, I've always been trying, I, I've been thinking about like, what were the things that were causing that could have been like people, you, you know, you had, um you guys had gotten married, that's

00:42:45.239 - 00:43:02.250

what I'm married in kids, married in kids. And that's, that changes a lot of the things you have to have a babysitter, you know, and that was the thing with, with us playing in California is I had a babysitter for my Children until they were 16.

00:43:02.820 - 00:43:18.760

One time I had a gig and I, I had, I like gigs that are constant every two weeks, you know, and I love being the happy hour gig playing right before whoever wants to go on next. Let me warm you up. Ok. All right. We're gonna

00:43:18.770 - 00:43:36.110

have a good time here. We're having a couple of drinks. Let's get warmed up. We're gonna, you know, get ready. And so, um, with my Children they knew 6 to 8 mom was down the road. I mean, one time, Andre forgot his guitar and I came

00:43:36.120 - 00:43:51.540

back, there was 75 Children at my house and Children on the roof of the house. And I had to say, hey, hey, hey, everybody out of here. No way. Come back at eight when we're done and everybody can get in the pool, you know, but raising

00:43:51.550 - 00:44:11.729

Children were, you know, just changed. The, the, you had to pay the mortgage note and playing music. The only one, Richard Dobson Lucinda. Ok. Those guys, they made it, you know, to pay the mortgage note. Andre, you know, uh, had to work a job. We worked

00:44:11.739 - 00:44:29.129

jobs and music was a hobby even though we did it all weekend long, you know, still didn't pay 1700 a month for just the mortgage note. You know, everything else comes, you know, on top of that, you need a big check. What were some of the

00:44:29.139 - 00:44:49.739

jobs that you had out in LA? I had my own cleaning business and I hired all my own, my girlfriends and, uh, we either took the Children or you know, or we were in a mother's group. So, you know, we, you know, worked off babysitting times,

00:44:49.750 - 00:45:07.959

we go back and forth and they would babysit for me when we played at night. Ok. And that was a long night. I mean, for $100 you don't know how hard you work for $100 for the four sets and you have to go and drive an

00:45:07.969 - 00:45:23.739

hour out there, set up the PA, I mean, you know, and then get everybody else who are walking in with one little thing. Here we go and they walk out, you know, taking home the P A and then putting the P A in the garage, you

00:45:23.750 - 00:45:38.120

know, you don't get home till four in the morning, you know, and then the kids get up at six. I mean, you had to, you had to be tough. I didn't think I'd ever make it, but I did. It's amazing. So you had, it was hard

00:45:38.129 - 00:45:53.750

to kind of balancing that you had to be a jack of all trades. Yes. And you know, that's why mothers are, can multitask and, you know, and getting your husband to work. I had to get up at four in the morning. Just say, come on, baby,

00:45:53.760 - 00:46:10.610

you gotta go, you gotta go, you gotta go, here's your coffee lunch, get out the door. You know, I mean, seriously, if I didn't do that, we wouldn't be sitting where we're sitting. So why did you guys end up moving back to Texas and then going

00:46:10.620 - 00:46:28.669

to um, Elgin? Well, um, Andre, uh you know, we used to write songs about this. We were only supposed to be there one year and then UCL A offered Andre a Godly amount of money that, you know, we said, yeah, I can't refuse that. So, you

00:46:28.679 - 00:46:46.620

know, that's why we started bands out there and everybody from Texas used to fly out. We had concerts for Richard Dobson at my house. You know, we hung out with Lucinda in California. Doug lay, you know, we did that whole thing. We, we were, you know,

00:46:46.629 - 00:47:14.270

went to the music venues that had rock and roll and folk, you know, they had them all and we, we definitely were a part of supporting our friends, supporting them and then we would come to Houston, I mean, to Houston and Austin and Galveston. We do

00:47:14.280 - 00:47:31.260

all three with the trips at least at least two times a year, sometimes three, sometimes four. You know, it's, it was depending if Andre was playing with Sean Walters and, you know, or uh Hemorrhage Mountain Boys or anything like that or if any of our friends

00:47:31.270 - 00:47:46.729

had a gig, we had enough money that we could do. And that was the thing if, you know, even if it was a little gig, you know, they were making $100 cost us thousands to get there. But, you know, it's so what it was so worth

00:47:46.739 - 00:48:07.360

it. We were a number one fans. Yeah. And that was important. That was really important when you were in California. This was the time that um were you also there for the time when Lucinda started to make their kind of Lucinda and Clyde. Yes. Yes. Yes.

00:48:07.679 - 00:48:25.139

Yes. I remember one gig it was in Hollywood and um and I just brought all pictures, you know, and you know, because we go back Lucinda and I go back to when she was really having in, in the beginning days of the A E and, you

00:48:25.149 - 00:48:42.120

know, and, and staying in time and everything, it was cute. And, um, you know, and she just had a talent. She had, she was so she was gonna be a star, she's gonna be a star. You could feel it. She, she um, she just had it

00:48:42.330 - 00:48:58.590

and, um, you know, when we were in Hollywood and, and it was after the show and, and everything and uh she had the place is packed and she was looking at the picture and she said, hey, everybody, I just for a second, she says I want

00:48:58.600 - 00:49:19.649

you to know this girl knows me longer than any of you in this whole room. You know, you know, you've lived the life and experiencing those new beginnings are a powerful thing and I'm glad that she remembers, you know, because I sure do. And, you know,

00:49:19.659 - 00:49:38.199

these are stories from my side of this, of, of the plane. But, you know, I'm glad that, you know, people still do remember, you know, and I'm, I'm very proud of you that you're doing this for the folk music, for the scene in the seventies and

00:49:38.209 - 00:50:01.629

eighties. And thank you for doing that. It's a lot of fun. Yes. Yes. Um, so, um OK, you kind of, you've mentioned it before, you have this kind of community center in a sense. There's a whole group of you that now live together in Elgin. And,

00:50:01.639 - 00:50:20.949

um, can you talk about that? Well, we're all, you know, most of them musicians and, um, you know, uh, Lucy and Francy bought the land, um, many years ago and they keep on telling me I can't remember dates as well as those two. Those two are

00:50:20.959 - 00:50:37.840

phenomenal. They're, they remember everything. Um, and I always wanted Lucy's land, always wanted that piece of property. I would love Francy and I would come into Francis House and Francine and Steven always rolled out the red carpet, you know, as we did for everybody who came

00:50:37.850 - 00:51:02.820

to California too for our one year stay. And, um, she turned into 18 years that one and, um, you know, um, the, uh, property came, uh, for sale across the street and Lacy wanted that 15 acres. She, because she had horses and she, she really wanted

00:51:02.830 - 00:51:21.409

that acreage and she had 68 acres out in Nashville stealth too. But she wanted that property to be near Francy and to be near Tom Cranston. Tom Cranston and Donna mcnees bought the property next door. And so, you know, we watched Tom build his house. We're

00:51:21.419 - 00:51:39.750

still watching Tom build his house, but it's still, you know, it's a process, it's a process. It's all, it's all good. Um, but, um, we, uh, she called me and I was out in California and Lucy said, do you want that land? And I said, yes,

00:51:39.949 - 00:52:01.090

yes. So I probably formally asked Stephen and Tom, would they mind me living next door? Because, you know, I, I'm a force to be reckoned with and I cook have cocktails. So, so of course, Steven because Steven loves me. Tom loves me. He said, yes, we

00:52:01.100 - 00:52:17.719

love it. But, and I said, hell, no, I want that. He goes, you buy it with your money. I said, ok, you die. I'm gonna have the land here. I know where I'm going. And so out of my business, I bought the land and I made

00:52:17.729 - 00:52:35.719

a couple of payments and, and said, you really want that. Ok. All right, you want that anything you want? Ok. So we took out a, a bunch of money and just paid off the land and he, he said, ok, and Debra Debra Bauer came to California

00:52:35.889 - 00:52:53.010

and Andre, she got a New Lexus off of her, her, one of her relatives. And so we're looking at the Lexus out in the in the driveway and it's like spectacular. And Andre pulls up and his Nissan ultimate and climbs out of the car and gets

00:52:53.020 - 00:53:06.219

out and he, his back and he goes, God, the job's killing me. And so I said, go jump in the pool, go jump in the pool. We, we'll have a cocktail in a minute and you know, we'll be inside. And so he walks in and Deborah

00:53:06.229 - 00:53:26.600

turns to me and she says, she says, did you hear what? He said? What? And he goes, she said, he said that job's killing him. He can retire now, can he? I said, yeah, but I like my job and I'm, I'm really booming now. I, we're

00:53:26.610 - 00:53:42.469

doing so well and I'm almost on the hill and to, to a show and I got a great band and you know what about me? And she goes, do you love him? I said, of course, I love him. He goes. She says, Sharon let him retire.

00:53:43.000 - 00:54:00.959

So I walked in the house and I said, Andre, you could retire. He went what I said today, tell them tomorrow you can retire. You will go back to Texas and we'll build this house. Swear to God, this is a God honest truth. I never lie

00:54:00.969 - 00:54:19.620

about anything. Stretch the truth. But you know not. But anyhow. So two weeks, he told me he says I'm here for two weeks and then I'm retiring. Retiring. It took two months for me to sell my house. He went to UCL A and designed this B

00:54:19.629 - 00:54:44.649

52 bomber house and drawings and their things and he had fun playing with it in two weeks, did this and then it was just, it was meant to be because everything that I wanted happened immediately. I would say, oh, you know, once, once my house and

00:54:44.659 - 00:55:10.330

Jocelyn's house were the last houses to sell in the booming market. So I went home to Texas with my son, Clinton and Andre and the dog Leo and started clearing the land. My son's not with us anymore, but his twin brother helped us frame the house,

00:55:10.340 - 00:55:26.959

you know, helped us build the house. Francy. And Andre when we first got there, Francy called me and she says, you know, you have a bulldozer here, bulldozing your road. She goes, you gotta hurry up and get here. I said, OK, we, we made it real

00:55:26.969 - 00:55:47.350

fast and took us nine months to clear the land, took us 14 months to build the house to move in. Uh the amazing amount of time, you know, nobody builds a mansion in the sky that in 14 months. And we did it actually, it was 14

00:55:47.360 - 00:56:11.379

months in total in total time. And I invite you to come to my mansion in the sky, I'll cook you dinner. So, um since you're kind of in retirement phase, now, sort of sort of sort of sort of um what are you doing now? And what

00:56:11.389 - 00:56:33.469

are your upcoming plans? Actually, I am having a blast. I'm having a blast. Waitressing. I am having so much fun. I do it whenever I want whenever I want an Italian restaurant. So I get to talk to everybody. You know, I'm my Italian New York, you

00:56:33.479 - 00:56:56.679

know, kind of thing. I have so much fun and I get to do it whenever I want and it's something different musically. I am not writing right now. I've kind of took a backstage to where I was being the audience for my husband and, you know,

00:56:56.969 - 00:57:13.129

all my friends, you know, they're wondering when I'll come out of the closet again. You never know. I, I'll play parties and stuff like that and I'll have picking parties at my house. But I, I, it's, it's a lot of work, eight hours, 10 hours and

00:57:13.139 - 00:57:34.419

all that work, putting into playing a gig that you, I played for seven years, every other Friday, 56 piece band for $60. So, we did that for $10 a piece. I mean, you know, it's a lot of work. It's a labor of love. It's a hobby.

00:57:34.449 - 00:57:53.360

You know, we had tons of people. We made the, the place lots of money and, you know, which I went there, Tuesday night and spent $100 on just buying people drinks. But, you know, it's, it's a lot of, it's different. I'd rather sit in for one

00:57:53.370 - 00:58:10.810

or two songs than have to book the gig and tell everybody. Come on down, come on down, come on down. It's a lot of work. It's hard work. I, I, I'm good at it but I'd rather be make, you know, everybody have a good time in

00:58:10.820 - 00:58:33.659

the bar and clap to for the songs and, you know, be appreciative of whoever is playing a lot of great new musicians. And since I am in retirement, I can enjoy it this way. It's not a stress, it's not pressure. And you know what, whenever I

00:58:33.669 - 00:58:56.875

say party people come, people come and everybody brings a dish and we sit there and play and play and you hear amazing music and you should come to Andre 70th. It's Thursday, Thursday, July 19 at, at 12 o'clock, we're filming, we're having a filming crew come

00:58:56.885 - 00:59:17.425

in for one of Andre's songs for one of the pr songs. And I'm choreographing the 75 people to, to sing and dance and we're gonna, I'm gonna have them lock arms and brothers and sisters. You know, we are together and we're going to heal the world.

00:59:17.969 - 00:59:32.639

It's gonna be um you will see the video when it's done. It's gonna be amazing. Andre's a little scared because, you know, he's like, you're not, you're, you're not in the band but you're taking over the video shots. But I'm good at this. You know, I

00:59:32.649 - 01:00:00.419

can make everybody turn dance, you know, on timing. You know. Bye. And do you feel like there's anything that we should cover that? We haven't? I think that, you know, I've gone the false spectrum of life in the music business that I am so content that

01:00:00.429 - 01:00:18.939

I played so many different places that I even had a $2000 gig one time. You know, I mean, I feel like I've, I've done it for myself and this is only really for me. People had a good time with me. But the main thing is I've

01:00:18.949 - 01:00:41.705

enjoyed it. I've enjoyed this ride. I've been blessed with such amazing, talented people that always wanted to play with me or asked me to play. I feel very grateful that I was given a chance to be a part of the music scene to even if it

01:00:41.715 - 01:01:04.820

was on the sidelines, you know, that they really appreciated me coming in. So that uh I feel very honored. I feel like I've had the golden front ticket in my life and I am so grateful for it. If I die tomorrow. I know that I've done

01:01:04.830 - 01:01:22.979

it all. I've seen it all. I've drank it all. I've danced it all and you know, the other band that's waiting for me on the other side, we're gonna do this more. That's how I feel. So I'm grateful. Thank you for letting me do this and

01:01:22.989 - 01:01:27.409

share my story. Thank you so much for coming in. Thank you.