00:00:03.780 - 00:00:14.470

Today is December 4th 2020. My name is Ann Shi. I'm with the Houston Asian American Archive. We're Interviewing Rogene Gee Calvert today for the Racial Justice and Civic

00:00:14.510 - 00:00:29.090

Engagement Special Collection. Thank you so much Rogene for being with us again. You're welcome, Ann. I appreciate you asking me. Um, to start, since it's been a while and also for the record, can you

00:00:29.090 - 00:00:43.350

tell us a little bit about yourself? I'd be glad to. My name is Rogene Gee Calvert. Gee is my maiden surname. I was born in Houston, Texas, many decades ago.

00:00:43.600 - 00:00:54.780

I won't tell you exactly how many, but it's been a while. But when I was, I was born and raised in a predominantly black neighborhood. It was actually transitioning at the

00:00:54.780 - 00:01:09.390

time, from mainly Jewish, or white and Jewish, to black. So as I was growing up it- it transitioned predominantly black. But there were still some elements of the Jewish community.

00:01:09.390 - 00:01:24.250

For example, across the street was a Orthodox Jewish synagogue, which, today is Shape Center, which is a very well known, important institution in the Third Ward Black community.

00:01:25.810 - 00:01:41.900

So that gives you a little bit of, I think, history of what I grew up knowing and being exposed to. When I went to public school elementary, it was during the days of segregation, so it was all white.

00:01:42.970 - 00:01:54.390

I had a lot of white and Jewish friends. So growing up in a predominantly black neighborhood, going to school in a predominantly white Jewish school or friends

00:01:54.390 - 00:02:11.160

and all class, again, I was exposed growing up to a very pretty diverse group of people. And as you may know, and others may know, the Chinese- early Chinese in the Houston area, were in the

00:02:11.230 - 00:02:19.820

grocery store business. So I actually grew up working in my neighbor's grocery store, which was across the street from my home.

00:02:20.260 - 00:02:33.060

So they were Chinese. We were not- we were not related. But we were very, very close, obviously, living there for 20 years. My mother used to cook dinner for that- for their family,

00:02:33.060 - 00:02:46.390

and we used to eat together. So I grew up, when I was before teenager, working in the grocery- their grocery store, and learning how to, you know, work and- and

00:02:46.610 - 00:02:58.470

collect money and mainly clerked, and everything. So, again, the customer base was primarily black, African American. And occasionally one of

00:02:58.470 - 00:03:14.370

the Orthodox rabbis would come over and buy things. So just the visual and, you know, personal exposure to all these different groups. I- I never questioned it, I just grew up knowing about it

00:03:14.560 - 00:03:32.660

and feeling comfortable with the different groups. I've grown up in Houston, primarily, I went to school in Austin, to college in Austin, so- and then, you know, I lived outside of the state after that for a few years, but my- my

00:03:32.660 - 00:03:44.230

context is Houston. And I've always been active in the community. And some of the organizations that I got active with when I was a

00:03:44.470 - 00:03:56.660

young professional, I- I- I actually started out in more of a diverse community. I was involved with a group called the Inter Ethnic Forum.

00:03:57.240 - 00:04:11.420

It was a research project. And that's how it started out. But then we became a 501c3, a nonprofit, and the purpose of it was to enhance

00:04:11.530 - 00:04:28.090

and increase interactions between groups, because our research had shown that different groups had more in common than they were different. And this was back in the 90s, in the early

00:04:28.090 - 00:04:42.710

90s, so, you know, back then we were just broaching the whole diverse issues and inter-ethnic, interracial, intergroup relations. So I worked with them for

00:04:42.710 - 00:04:59.430

several years. We did a couple of research projects and community forums. Also, I've been involved in a lot of groups that really were committed to and supported inter-ethnic,

00:04:59.600 - 00:05:11.840

interracial relations. Leadership groups such as the American Leadership Forum, Leadership Houston; these are groups that promote, you know, working together and communicating well together.

00:05:14.670 - 00:05:29.010

So just, again, a little background about how I sort of grew up, what my exposure was, my knowledge, my comfort level, and all. So I think that would explain kind of some of my views.

00:05:30.660 - 00:05:47.440

That's great. Thank you so much for taking us through your personal history with multi ethnicities. And since May, as we all have been following the news, and for the record, this is a lot of social unrest, as

00:05:47.440 - 00:06:01.940

well as the conversations around Black Lives Matter and the protest going on. And we just want to know a little bit more about your relationship with the Black Lives Matter. After, yeah, learning so much about

00:06:01.940 - 00:06:14.580

your personal history. Well, I'm gonna dive deeper in the back past. In my past. It wasn't called Black Lives Matter then. You know, it was more civil rights and equal justice

00:06:15.960 - 00:06:28.080

and civic engagement. Um, the Black Lives Matter label, I think it's more recent, as you point out. And so I certainly relate to it.

00:06:28.080 - 00:06:39.760

But I'd like to maybe go back a little bit further in history about the whole coming together, if you will, of the black community and the Asian American community.

00:06:40.160 - 00:06:57.560

So, you know, I think people don't realize that the Asian American history of civil rights and social justice has been going on for decades. Some people know about the Chinese Exclusion Act.

00:06:57.850 - 00:07:13.190

And, of course, that was 1882 when that- that legislation was passed by Congress, and it was- it was identified as the most discriminatory legislation that our country probably has ever

00:07:13.420 - 00:07:31.790

passed. And then a series of other legislation over the next few years also backed it up. But the bottom line is Chinese were not allowed to come in this country unless you were part of a merchant class or an

00:07:32.020 - 00:07:46.500

educator. So certain, very small groups back then, were allowed to come over, but in general, people were not. Chinese were not. And we were singled out, you know, and we were, we were put in the same

00:07:46.500 - 00:08:01.950

category, as you know, morons, and deranged people and all. It was- it was not good. My father was a young man when he came over here, and it was still during the Chinese Exclusion Act.

00:08:02.630 - 00:08:18.850

And that caused a lot of young Chinese men in particular, to come up over under false papers. So he was- he was called a paper son. He came over through Angel Island, and Angel Island,

00:08:19.760 - 00:08:31.970

even though it was an immigration station, it was very different from the West Coast- oh the East Coast of Angel I- mean of Ellis Island. Ellis Island is always considered a welcoming, you know, with the

00:08:31.970 - 00:08:43.510

Statue of Liberty there to welcome the newcomers, but Angel Island had a different climate and feeling and attitude and it was very strict and rigid.

00:08:44.000 - 00:08:58.470

And some people stayed on the i- the immigration station on the island for a long time, and my dad was one of them. So my learning about what he went through and learning about the history of a lot of Chinese that came

00:08:58.470 - 00:09:13.130

over at that- that period of time through Angel Island also shaped my feelings about discrimination and civil rights. I have always been involved in advocacy

00:09:13.960 - 00:09:29.660

organizations like OCA, which is an Asian American, and- and, you know, they're very broad now. They really embrace all Asian cultures and ethnicities, but they're a strong advocacy group.

00:09:30.620 - 00:09:49.120

And I bring them up because the reason OCA was created back in 1970s, is because of the murder of a young man called Vincent Chin in Detroit. And Vincent Chin was on the eve of his marriage of

00:09:49.180 - 00:10:02.530

his wedding date, was murdered by three white auto workers in Detroit. And it was in the, like I said, early 70s when the- the Japanese auto industry was

00:10:02.530 - 00:10:15.720

become- was growing and- and really competing strongly with the American auto industry. And these three men mistook him for Japanese- being Japanese and thought he was Japanese, so they beat him to

00:10:15.720 - 00:10:30.350

death. His case, to me is like the George Floyd case, that really sparked a movement. Well, Vincent Chin's murder and trial of the killers

00:10:31.800 - 00:10:44.170

were- was also a movement. And that's what got OCA started. And after that, a lot of other advocacy. It was like Asian Americans found their voice with this incident,

00:10:44.680 - 00:10:59.870

because one of the reasons, not only because he was so violently killed and mistaken, you know, just like in COVID days, right now, the Chi- you know, the Chinese virus, as some people have labeled it, a lot of Asians

00:10:59.870 - 00:11:15.200

have been affected because people think they're Chinese. So, you know, people don't see differences, and it doesn't matter, but nonetheless, the three killers of Vincent Chin were put on trial, and they got off very

00:11:15.200 - 00:11:30.580

lightly. And I think the punish- the lack of punishment, to meet- to fit the crime was really what got people incensed. So I put those two together, because with the George Floyd

00:11:30.740 - 00:11:43.660

movement, and with his death that really sparked a lot of the Black Lives Matter movement, I see- I see the the murder of Vincent Chin being very similar.

00:11:44.200 - 00:11:57.880

And we started an OCA chapter here in the 80s. And, of course, we still go back to Vincent Chin's murder as sort of, again, a call for action.

00:12:00.180 - 00:12:13.370

Also, I think we've always felt like we'll be labeled foreigners, Asians, because we look differently, just like the black community. You know, they cannot get away from how they look.

00:12:14.350 - 00:12:27.160

And- and so I think we share that as well. The fact that we look different, and that people, when they look at us, you know, consider as foreigners or outsiders or not being part

00:12:27.230 - 00:12:39.680

of the mainstream. I wanted to mention that back in the early civil rights days, during Martin Luther King's March, and all of his ad- advocacy, there were

00:12:39.750 - 00:12:54.450

Asians involved in that. Maybe not really well known, and- but- but there were Asians involved, if you look at photographs, you'll- you'll see them. So- also see Cesar Chavez with the

00:12:54.450 - 00:13:06.550

Latino movement, with the farmworkers, you know, protest and movement. There were Asians involved with that. So they've been Asians involved in those civil rights battles.

00:13:07.420 - 00:13:24.900

Locally, you know, I, having been here in Houston for a long time, I've been involved with our local, black, African American advocacy groups, like the NAACP here, Urban League, the Hispanic groups

00:13:25.300 - 00:13:38.360

like LULAC. And it's been important that we work together because, you know, alone, we're not as strong, but if we can work together.

00:13:38.780 - 00:13:52.510

And we just have to find those goals, and missions that overlap, and that are common so that we can. And I think the George Floyd murder and the whole Black

00:13:52.580 - 00:14:06.270

Lives Matter movement has been that when you look at it, the crowds and the- the masses that protest and marched in everything, you'll see a lot of different ethnicities,

00:14:07.360 - 00:14:26.440

including Asians, various different Asians as well, ages, genders. And so I think it really brought a lot of groups together. So I think we just need to encourage and enable all of our

00:14:26.440 - 00:14:45.230

groups to be able to learn each other's history, because there was an incident about two years ago with a black leader. And she was heard saying that she didn't think Asians jumped in to

00:14:45.230 - 00:15:01.600

support the black community when they were discriminated against. And it caused some uproar and the media got ahold of it. And I was one of the people that was asked about that, and interviewed, and we had a chance because of the

00:15:03.540 - 00:15:16.920

efforts of another community leader who brought us together, to talk. And this, this person that had said these things, she was unaware of the Asian

00:15:16.920 - 00:15:31.160

history, of the Chinese American history and Asian in general, until we, you know, we talked about it. And that really helped mend, you know, that hurt that that was done, but also a better understanding.

00:15:31.270 - 00:15:48.400

And we just need more opportunity for that kind of exchange. Because especially the newer generations, and the newer people- the newer visitors to our country or residents to our country are not always aware of

00:15:48.400 - 00:16:08.500

that history. I think the other thing that has really helped our movement sort of speak, identity is vice- Vice President Elect Kamala Harris. She embodies exactly where we all are, across, you know,

00:16:08.600 - 00:16:25.380

cultural person, she is- has an Asian Indian mother, and a black father, and really embodies, you know, the best of both worlds, and there's a lot of interracial marriage- marrying going

00:16:25.380 - 00:16:43.010

on. So eventually, I think all of the people will be inter- inter, you know, woven together. And that may be a good, you know, solution, if you will, or a way to address race relations, is that there

00:16:43.010 - 00:16:54.930

will be a lot of interfering. It's interesting, though, with Vice President Elect Harris, I think she is, you know, she talks about her mother a lot.

00:16:54.930 - 00:17:09.140

She attributes a lot of her success and everything to her mother. And she always describes her, you know, as an Indian immigrant that came here. However, she is identified more as a black woman.

00:17:10.020 - 00:17:24.270

I mean, even though she is interracial. And I think that's been something our country has perpetuated. That, you know, and if you go back in history, you'll know if you have like, 1/16th, you know, ounce or

00:17:24.270 - 00:17:42.000

whatever, 1/16th degree of black blood, you are considered black. So, in a way for Asians, it's like a secondary thought, oh, yeah, she's also Asian, because her black identity comes usually first.

00:17:42.000 - 00:17:55.160

And I'm not saying that's bad. I'm just saying that that's the way it is, because of the way our country is. It used to be a negative thing to have black blood, obviously, but you know, that's been

00:17:55.480 - 00:18:11.580

changed. The other person, President Obama, he was also he was- he didn't have Asian blood in him, but his mother, I think, married an Asian, he has a half sister who's Asian. That's- that was my point.

00:18:12.080 - 00:18:26.180

And, you know, we Asians always tried to kind of claim him also, but he was, you know, obviously interracial, white and black. So, that- those are

00:18:26.180 - 00:18:40.330

just some phenomenons that are going on, but I think rather than looking at it as being a negative thing, it's a very positive thing. And really ties the Black Lives Matter movement more to, let's say, the Asian American

00:18:42.480 - 00:18:58.880

advocacy, civil rights and social justice movement as well. Because I think we do all share some of the same ramifications. I mean, if you go back in history, there were hangings and really violent crimes of the

00:18:59.020 - 00:19:10.900

Chinese railroad workers or gold miners or, I mean, there's just a lot in history. It's not talked about, because a lot of our history is not taught. But it's been as

00:19:10.900 - 00:19:25.350

violent and- and all as, as, you know, the- the black community. Now, of course, they came over as slaves. And- and that's a little different, although some of the Chinese workers

00:19:25.910 - 00:19:39.300

were brought over here, but many of them came voluntarily for better conditions. What they didn't realize is the conditions were going to be a lot worse, you know, because many of them got killed working on the railroad or

00:19:39.700 - 00:19:54.870

doing- doing things. But I hope we can celebrate more of our sameness, similarities than our differences, which goes back to my work with the Inter Ethnic Form that we have much more in common

00:19:54.870 - 00:20:05.180

than we do difference. So I hope that helps a lot and has added to your body of knowledge. Yeah, thank you so much.

00:20:05.220 - 00:20:22.610

That's a great story that we haven't read a lot in history books. Thank you for covering that. And next, I'm wondering what are some of the, like interesting conversations you've had in the past few months, either within or outside of your

00:20:22.650 - 00:20:39.800

community. Or— Well, we held- I was part of a group this summer. And we had created a project. It started off wanting to raise money to help our Asian owned restaurants who were

00:20:40.730 - 00:20:53.540

struggling during COVID. And so what we did is we raised money to purchase meals from the restaurants. And we gave them to frontline worker or heroes.

00:20:54.120 - 00:21:08.100

And they range from health wor- health care workers, to transportation workers, post office, public works and public service employees, you know, for the city or county.

00:21:10.350 - 00:21:23.010

A part of that project was an advocacy piece, because we had heard of a lot of discrimination, racial bias and threats that were coming on our Asian community.

00:21:23.690 - 00:21:39.920

And so we brought to Houston, two heroes that were in Midland, Texas. And they had saved the lives of a Burmese family, a father and two sons, who were stabbed by somebody

00:21:40.480 - 00:21:55.850

that was in a store, he grabbed a knife, I don't know how he got it, but he grabbed a knife started to stab them. And these two bystanders jumped into help. And thanks to them, they saved the lives of this father

00:21:55.850 - 00:22:11.460

and his two and six year old son. So that was also a time that we got to talk about. We had a panel discussion, where we brought in some black leaders.

00:22:12.100 - 00:22:24.690

And talked about how it was similar to the Asian American plight, and that's when Vincent Chin was brought up again and George Floyd, but we had that panel, it's recorded.

00:22:25.430 - 00:22:40.640

Maybe you could get a copy, I think it would be very interesting. We had Helen Zia, on the panel. And Helen is a wonderful civic leader, as well as a journalist and a writer, an

00:22:40.640 - 00:22:55.900

author rather, and she was on the panel to talk about Vincent Chin. Because back when he was murdered, Helen helped his mother advocate for his, you know, on behalf of- of- of his death.

00:22:57.460 - 00:23:14.510

And then we had Cherry Steinwender, who is the founder and the head, a co-leader of a local nonprofit group, whose name just escapes me this moment, I'm sorry.

00:23:16.660 - 00:23:25.050

But anyway, we had her on the panel. And Cherry’s been fighting the fight for a long time. She's- like me-- she's been around for a long time.

00:23:25.560 - 00:23:38.870

But she's always been collaborative, and has brought in other groups to discuss the racial, the Center for Racial Harmony, or I

00:23:38.890 - 00:23:48.430

think it's the name of it. So her aim has always been to talk about, again, what I'm saying the similarities and the importance in working together.

00:23:52.440 - 00:24:07.890

Yeah, that was one of the things we've done recently. Yeah, thank you for the work you do for the community. And next time, I'm just wondering, as we both heard and talked about briefly, that there was a

00:24:08.040 - 00:24:21.230

Vietnamese gentleman who posted, out of his own funds, the Black Lives Matter billboard by the highway, and he received a backlash from his own Vietnamese community. Can you talk a little bit about that?

00:24:21.270 - 00:24:31.710

What do you think? Well, I don't know him personally. I heard about it happening. I unfortunately didn't get a chance to go there because I think they- state representative

00:24:32.410 - 00:24:47.680

Gene Wu was one of the leaders that- and Hubert Vo, state representative Hubert Vo, I think they held a rally or something to support him. You know, it's unfortunate that he was met with that backlash.

00:24:49.330 - 00:25:02.040

But I find that a lot of times our Asian American community can also be very discriminatory. I mean, it's inherent in all of us. I think we just have to try

00:25:02.040 - 00:25:15.940

hard not to let it take over, but I think what happened is, he's Vietnamese as you mentioned. And the Vietnamese community, I always say this that you can't just say Asian American monolithically are

00:25:16.110 - 00:25:30.590

similar. We all come from different histories and backgrounds. And the Vietnamese came from a communistic country. And so they don't necessarily support a lot of things they

00:25:30.590 - 00:25:47.520

perceive as either being, you know, communistically lead, or- and they may have thought the Black Lives Matter was communistic or socialistic, whatever terms we use, we throw them around a lot.

00:25:48.180 - 00:26:00.220

And felt like this gentleman was supporting something that they were ideologically against because of their upbringing. I think a lot of the older Vietnamese citizens

00:26:02.450 - 00:26:18.240

have felt that way stronger because they had to flee their country. And Chinese had to flee China back in the 40s. And you know, they- to escape the communist takeover. So there's a lot of history there that- that some of us

00:26:18.240 - 00:26:31.520

who were not born then, or experienced it, we don't understand maybe or empathize with. I know I've always learned, and I don't know history that well, but even our own Asian ethnic groups, Koreans,

00:26:32.470 - 00:26:50.100

Japanese, Chinese, fought each other, you know, the Japanese took over China at some point in time and Korea. The Koreans and the Chinese and so even, well, probably it's fading more and more but- but a while back,

00:26:50.650 - 00:27:04.310

if you were up one ethnicity and you had those memories in your mind, you still harbored it. And even here in America, you would hear about older people who didn't like each other because of that history.

00:27:04.940 - 00:27:19.290

So again, I think we have to always remember if we can and learn about history, because it’s important. It gives the context for why things happen. But we also need to try to move along and

00:27:20.140 - 00:27:37.070

to work with each other and communicate with each other and to try to find those, again, similarities. Things that we hold dear that are the same common goals. Yeah, that's empowering.

00:27:37.610 - 00:27:57.820

And have you been kind of in the conversation with anyone who is anti-BLM by any chance? Um, not upfront and personal, let me put it that way. You know, I guess I've been around

00:27:57.820 - 00:28:13.500

long enough to try to just put myself in the environment of people that I agree with. I know that's not- I mean, I- I'm sure I'm up against people that we don't- actually within my own family, we

00:28:13.500 - 00:28:21.200

don't see things eye to eye on everything. But, um, but not- not really. I'm not exposed to that as much.

00:28:22.740 - 00:28:41.050

Thank you. And next, as you also touched upon that our most recent election results that the by- Joe Biden and Kamala Harris are in office very soon. And I'm just wondering, what are some of your thoughts

00:28:41.050 - 00:28:57.740

on the voter turnout this year? And why or- why or why not, I guess I shouldn't assume, did you vote? Oh , I always vote. I mean, voting is part of my, you know, human nature

00:28:57.740 - 00:29:11.800

and the right to vote- people have died for the right to vote, so I take it very seriously. I used to just vote in person until COVID came and decided maybe vote by mail was the way to do it just to be safer.

00:29:12.310 - 00:29:22.860

But all of this chaos with the by mail and, you know, vote by mail is- was crazy. But voting is very important. And I- my

00:29:22.860 - 00:29:38.980

children, everyone I'm exposed to you know, tried to encourage and this time, I really did reach out to my extended family and friends and reminded them to vote because it was an important election. I've worked

00:29:38.980 - 00:29:52.810

in voter registration, you know, trying to get people registered and this- I think the results should have shown, they come out already, that our Asian American community, AAPI community really increased

00:29:52.810 - 00:30:09.070

our voting. And that was really good. I think because a lot of the younger people voted this time and over the last 5 to 10 years, more resources have been put into the Asian community,

00:30:10.130 - 00:30:27.750

AAPI community, to get people registered, educated, and to get the vote out; to get them to go vote. So I think that people with the funds have realized how important the Asian community can be.

00:30:28.340 - 00:30:45.090

First of all, we've grown percentage wise more than any other group. We're the fastest growing group. And also the fact that once we get registered to, you know, vote, it's just getting out.

00:30:45.210 - 00:30:57.130

And you know, language has been an issue. Houston's very- Harris County is very fortunate that we have our ballot in four languages: English, Spanish, Vietnamese, and Chinese.

00:30:58.770 - 00:31:10.430

But that was something related to the census. We had to show we had a certain threshold number, or percentage of people that were limited English proficient before,

00:31:10.480 - 00:31:24.670

you know, they would qualify to put our ballot in another language. Our Korean friends would like to see it in Korean too, but, again, you've got to reach a certain threshold

00:31:24.670 - 00:31:35.570

before it's mandatory. Now, places could do it voluntarily, but that's not easy. Before the ballot was man- man- mandated to be put into

00:31:35.570 - 00:31:50.950

Chinese, we did talk to the county to see if we could translate some things into Chinese, and to have them give it out. But it was a rigorous process. And we had to fund it ourselves.

00:31:52.120 - 00:32:07.380

Which we did. But it was very limited. But then the next couple of years, with the census data to back it up, they- we were mandated to put- our county was one of the ones mandated to put the ballot

00:32:07.430 - 00:32:19.780

into Chinese. So that helps a lot, you know, when you can understand it, you- you will go do it. So the other thing was making it easier for

00:32:19.780 - 00:32:32.420

people to go vote. So there's been a lot of advocacy to try to have voting polls, early voting as well as regular- well, now it doesn't matter.

00:32:32.420 - 00:32:48.390

But before when you had to go vote at your precinct, voting on election day, or early voting polls, were you know, anywhere. We tried really hard to put some in the Asian areas so that our community could go vote easier.

00:32:50.790 - 00:33:03.410

Sorry. No worries. Great. Thank you so much. And next, I'm wondering since you spoke briefly about obstacles that prevented Asian Americans to vote earlier.

00:33:03.880 - 00:33:20.750

Besides language, what else do you see as the barriers? Um, that was the main one, was the written and spoken language. Well also your rights, voting rights. Because before the- well, the Voting Rights Act,

00:33:21.570 - 00:33:36.610

has provisions in it that says you are allowed to take somebody into the polls with you to help you. Of course, they're sure a couple of certain people you couldn't like your- if you were in a union, you couldn't take your union boss or

00:33:37.030 - 00:33:47.930

you know, somebody over you, but a family member or a friend or something, you- you can take them into the poll. I mean, actually there to help you translate and everything.

00:33:50.220 - 00:34:01.850

People didn't know that. So the- even the workers, the poll workers didn't know that. And there were incidences where some people brought their family

00:34:01.850 - 00:34:15.730

member in, and they wouldn't allow them to go in and help. So besides language- well, this is connected to language because they wanted to bring someone in to help them. But it's language assistance, not knowing the

00:34:16.870 - 00:34:32.340

provisions of the Voting Rights Act that allow you to- to bring someone in, prevented people from voting, or had their vote put into a provisional vote. So in other words, they may have let them vote but they had to set it aside.

00:34:32.740 - 00:34:43.910

Now whether that vote ever got counted, we don't know. So that was the location: being able to be accessible; language: understanding the

00:34:43.910 - 00:35:00.350

ballot; having someone go in and help you: being able to, you know, to actually vote if you needed the help. Those were the main things. I- I don't think we suffered any things like the

00:35:00.550 - 00:35:12.680

black community did early on when they were, they had to pay a poll tax. And you know, they had to pay a tax to vote. That was one way they suppress their vote.

00:35:13.810 - 00:35:28.440

I don't know if we ever- I don't think we ever had to go through that. But I think that it was be- because we weren't as much of a threat back then. You know, our numbers weren't as big. But now, I think the intimidation

00:35:29.440 - 00:35:42.190

sometimes that people who don't want you to vote, are there to intimidate you to make you scared of going in. Some of that may happen. But, you know, hopefully not a lot.

00:35:43.450 - 00:35:59.090

But people need to understand their rights and that's- that's part of the education. That's great. Thank you so much. And next I'm wondering how your opinion as the Asian American

00:35:59.090 - 00:36:14.740

identity and their values and influence their participation in civic engagement. Um, I think initially, it's hard for, especially our immigrant population. I come from a different

00:36:14.740 - 00:36:30.590

country, what, you know, in Asia, because so many of them have come from a country that had a lot of, you know, laws and leaders that prevented them. And, you know, they could get killed for voting.

00:36:30.590 - 00:36:40.920

I mean, they were not encouraged to vote. So when they come here, it's a whole new experience. The freedom and the- the opportunity to vote.

00:36:41.230 - 00:36:57.580

So it takes a little while to understand that and to exercise it. So I think, you know, again, going back to history, upbringing, culture, prohibiting people to vote, and

00:37:01.670 - 00:37:12.230

yeah, so I'm not- I'm not sure if I answered your question, Ann. I got off thinking about my answer and I- you want to repeat your question again?

00:37:13.170 - 00:37:25.970

Oh, I think you like really well said it, that there's different differences among different Asian American identities. And next, I'm wondering with the different generations, how do you

00:37:25.970 - 00:37:35.370

see different generations perceive voting rights? Like, for example, between you and your older generations and the younger generations?

00:37:35.370 - 00:37:49.960

What are some of the conversations you got into? Well, that's where you get to differences of positions and policies, and, I guess, party affiliation, things like that.

00:37:49.960 - 00:38:06.890

I think- and this is a generality. For the most part, the younger generation, I think will see things much more progressively, and probably align more with the Democratic party with some of their

00:38:06.890 - 00:38:24.980

policies and all, but that's not always true. There are also people whose, because of their work, and their sphere of influence, maybe the people they run around with, they tend to be more on the conservative

00:38:24.980 - 00:38:39.570

side, and they align with, you know, another party. I find that my own family. Yeah, so one of my children works in a- in the energy business.

00:38:40.040 - 00:38:55.910

And so that tends to be a little bit more pro-corporate, pro-business, pro-energy, and aligns more with, you know, a certain party. So it depends on really where they, you

00:38:55.910 - 00:39:12.300

know, what their- what their environment is like. What they're doing in terms of their work, their business, because if they're in a business that, you know, is against unions, for example, or against- or-

00:39:14.500 - 00:39:30.910

or pro- pro renewable energies versus oil and gas, that could shape your policies, and therefore you align more with parties and policies that are gonna help you in your- in your work.

00:39:31.590 - 00:39:47.350

So, um- but I think in general, the younger generation is going to see things more progressively. And plus, they- the environment is a major issue for the younger generation. Which I'm glad because I

00:39:47.350 - 00:39:59.680

think, my generation and even before me and maybe slightly after me, we- we took- we've taken the environment for granted.

00:40:00.360 - 00:40:16.060

You know, we've always had endless resources, and it's just frightening to see that it's being harmed. So- so that's one good thing about, you know, I think young people.

00:40:16.480 - 00:40:31.400

On the other hand, for some policies, I think you need a little bit of experience to also shape it. And if you're just getting out of college or, you know, maybe starting your first job and all, you may not

00:40:31.400 - 00:40:42.000

have experienced a lot of things to, to solidify how you feel. You just kind of see things on TV or social media. And you feel

00:40:42.000 - 00:40:56.820

like, oh, that's, that's what I should be believing. So I think it takes a little experience and time for you to- to gel your opinions, and to- to be able to make a real,

00:41:00.900 - 00:41:12.770

informed decision. But I don't fault young people at all for that. I mean, that has to come with age and experience. You're, you know, you aren't born with it

00:41:12.770 - 00:41:23.700

overnight. What you're born with this your family's influence on you, or your friends. So that's your first thing is what you grow up with.

00:41:24.330 - 00:41:38.590

But then as you experience life, and work and family and your own, your own experiences, you shape your opinions. So that's what you probably end up with. Yeah, thank you for sharing.

00:41:39.310 - 00:41:55.040

And guess next, I really am curious about how you think racial justice and civic engagement can stay relevant for us, even when this topic has been washed off from social media about other hot topics?

00:41:56.110 - 00:42:06.190

I don't think it ever will be. Not- not in this day and age and not with the world so interconnected. You know, I don't think it will.

00:42:06.710 - 00:42:20.540

The important thing is for people to kind of keep it alive in their own mind. But it's- it's always there. But it may be kind of a less, more subtle than other times

00:42:20.540 - 00:42:32.840

because it, it takes an incident, unfortunately, to maybe spark it again, or a personal experience. But it's always there.

00:42:32.970 - 00:42:43.790

It's always going to be there. And it's important for us to support, support it. Because that's how we will, I think improve it, is to keep working at it.

00:42:45.820 - 00:42:58.610

Yeah, absolutely. I guess to end with the kind of reflective note, what are, what are your kind of words for your future self when you watch back?

00:42:58.960 - 00:43:17.230

For example, in 2024, to rewatch this interview with us? What kind of words would you want to tell the future of you? Oh, well, I guess I'll end with what I started with, which is to look for the common things with

00:43:17.520 - 00:43:36.000

other people. And, and even though I said to you that I don't usually expose myself to people that are totally different minded than me, it is important to, to hear them. I used to listen to the radio, talk radio,

00:43:36.830 - 00:43:52.420

because I thought, you know, at least it gives me another perspective. I got tired of it after a while. But nonetheless, it's always good to hear the other side. And I just want to encourage people and myself to

00:43:52.420 - 00:44:07.490

continue to communicate, to try to affiliate. So go out of your way to meet people that are different. And learn from them. Always learn. Always be in an educational mode.

00:44:07.890 - 00:44:21.610

Because everything you do you learn from and hopefully you grow from. Wow that's really empowering and thank you so much Rogene for sharing with us. Thank you Ann. I appreciate it.