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Annesha Dey: Hi, I'm Annesha Dey and I'm a researcher on this project. Lori Lozano: Hi, I'm Lori Lozano and nice to meet you Annesha. Annesha: Nice to meet you as well. So the first question that I have to start us off is, where did you grow up and where is home to you? Lori: Well, I was born in Houston and I grew up in Houston, in and around Houston. And Texas is definitely home to me, but also, too, I carry my home within me so I can feel at home most places, as long as I'm okay within myself.

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Annesha: That makes sense. And then do you have any sort of tribal affiliation, and if so, would you mind sharing a little bit about that and your background? Lori: Sure. Growing up, I did not have any tribal affiliation. Nothing was said about that, that I can remember. Now, I do have a tribal affiliation, and that is with the Esto’k Gna, the Carrizo/Comecrudo, and that is through just researching later and finding them and connecting with them, and I'm a member now. Annesha: So you talk a little bit about — so when was, I guess, the point where you discovered your identity and can you talk about that shift for you personally? Lori: About my identity, like my ethnicity?

00:01:53.000 - 00:04:19.000

Annesha: Yeah. So you said you didn't go with any really understanding of it, and it was very silenced. So I'd just like to hear if you're comfortable sharing a little bit about that experience discovering it. Lori: Okay. I guess the first time I remember having any questions about it was I might've been in fifth grade. Lori: And we had moved from an area in Houston more to the outskirts. And I don't remember if I was getting questioned at school or people were asking me, but I just remember coming home and saying, “Mom, what are we?” And I'm pretty sure she said — I feel like I did that for a couple of days. And I went to school, and then I may have told people like, “Oh, I'm Mexican.” And then I came back home and said, and then I feel like on a different day, she said, “oh, we're Italian.” And then on a different day she said — no, she didn't say Italian. I think she said German. And then on a different day she said Cherokee. And I was completely confused and just didn't care anymore. All I knew is I think that it just came on the scene in my life, that aspect of, and not for me, it was from outside of me. Lori: I feel like it was because we were in a different area of town, and then just the age probably. So that was that. And I think the thing that stuck and made sense was Mexican. So I think moving forward, I carried that with me a little more. So I think it really didn't come up later until, oh man, I really don't know. I feel like it wasn't a huge issue in my life until when I was 20 and I moved to South Texas, and that was where there was a lot of people that were of Mexican heritage and culture, where I realized that I had been separated from that, because I had to pronounce my name now with the Spanish accent, because if I didn't, they would definitely let me know. No, no, no, no, no, you're not Lori. You're Lori. I was like, oh, okay.

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Lori: So that came into play because South Texas is definitely along the border and in some ways, in a lot of ways more connected seemed like anyways, seems like. So I lived there for five years, and as I was leaving, I met this guy and he had a feather in his hair, and he was real, kind of, in my opinion at the time, a little bit, kind of a cross between hippie-ish and something else I don't know. I really didn't know what it was, but he was brown, and he said, you really ought to learn more about your culture. And I was thoroughly confused. And at that time I was probably about twenty-six, and I was like, what do you mean? And I think I even said that to him, and he just, instead of answering me, he just took the feather out of his hair and he put it in my hair, and I was like, okay, okay. I'm going to get a Kleenex. Annesha: Okay, no worries. Lori: I don't know why this makes me emotional. Lori: Okay. Yeah.

00:05:56.000 - 00:07:09.000

Lori: So that's pretty much it on that side. Lori: But I accidentally ended up moving to California, and I say accidentally because it was very unplanned, and I moved to California. My cousin was there on a temporary job, and my mom had told me about it. I was just about to move back to Houston. I was like, South Texas isn't working out for me for a lot of reasons. So, I went to go visit my cousin. It was just supposed to be a one week trip, and when I got there, I just didn't want to come back home. I was like, I just can't go back. So that was the best thing for me culturally and spiritually and as a person, and just helped me grow, helped me sit with myself. Like w ho is this person called Lori? You know? Annesha: Thank you for sharing that with me. Lori: For sure.

00:07:09.000 - 00:07:27.000

Annesha: Yeah. And I am wondering, so where do you live currently now? In California? Lori: Oh, no, I'm in Austin. I'm in Austin, yeah. I was gone, though, from Texas for ten years. Annesha: Okay, I see. Lori: But I came back. Yeah. Yeah.

00:07:27.000 - 00:08:20.000

Annesha: Gotcha. And so what made you, I guess, move back from — because I'm actually from California too, I'll mention— Lori: Okay. I love California. Annesha: Yeah, yeah, for sure. What made you move back to Texas, I guess more recently? Lori: Yeah. Well, I moved back in 2015. The interesting thing about that was it felt almost instant. The moment that I left Texas and I landed in California, my dreams changed. I instantly started having dreams, a lot of dreams with my grandma who had passed in 2000, which is the same year that I left Houston to go to South Texas. She passed that year.

00:08:20.000 - 00:10:38.000

Lori: And that was really hard, but I just feel like, I don't even remember completely mourning. I remember crying a lot, but I don't remember it being such a huge deal. It was just the next phase of my life. But when I went to California, she showed up. So that's what I mean is my dreams just started changing. I was having dreams that I just was like, what is this? I remember one dream I had where, well, one really — right when I got to California, she showed up in my dreams, and she walked up to me and she took her shoes off and she gave them to me. She was like, you wear these now. So I was like, what? I didn't understand it completely, but it was interesting. And another dream I had, I could see above from a bird's eye view. It was, I don't know what kind of a person it was, if it was an Asian person or Indigenous person, but I could see them on a long boat with a hat like this made a straw and they were rowing, and it was really cool, and it was just no dreams I ever had before. So from the moment I got to California, it's like all my ancestors came with me. They were like, we're here. So it was just really interesting. Lori: I forgot the question. Annesha: Oh, no, totally good. There was really no official question, I guess. But I do have one question. Well, so you're talking a lot about your ancestors and your family, I guess, from your family side, is there anyone in particular that kind of stands out to you as someone that maybe helped you learn about your identity and background and more family history? Lori: Really, that came later. That came later because I had a lot of unpacking to do because, so I'm also gay, so that also made things and spread them out. The work I needed to do was vast. It wasn't just cultural anymore.

00:10:38.000 - 00:12:06.000

Lori: So being gone from Texas helped with that too. So I wasn't as focused on cultural, but I kind of was. Because California, the beautiful thing about California is it seemed like, first of all, they were using a word called Chicano, which I adopted instantly. I'm like, this is it. Because the word, what we used in Texas at the time was either Hispanic or Mexican, and both of those seemed to be extreme in both directions. I'm like, but I'm from Texas. And then the other one was like, what's that? Hispanic sounded so, I'm not sure — it just didn't fit. Lori: So I instantly heard the word Chicano, and I was like, that's me. And I started walking everywhere around the Bay Area, which is where I had landed, and I just went to all these events. There was the Chicano Moratorium, the Cesar Chavez Festival. I'm like, what? So it just blew my mind, and I was just instantly learning about who I was and the history behind the people that were like me. And I ate it up. I read every book I could, and it was just beautiful, stuff I've never heard of. So I didn't really relay back to family for who I was. I was looking in the present moment with what I was being shown in California. Great place to be for that for me. Annesha: I can totally understand. That's awesome. Lori: Yeah.

00:12:06.000 - 00:13:43.000

Annesha: I'm from the Bay Area too, actually, the Berkeley area. So I, I've been to a lot of these kinds of festivals as well myself, and I love the entire city. I miss it a lot. But yeah. Lori: Yes, it was very poignant for me. I love it there. The weather too. Everything was so different. I was like, it took several months until I was like, what is so different about this place? I was like, there's no mosquitoes. That's what it is. There were so many things. The plant life, the creature life, everything. The air quality is just so different. Pretty much what I call paradise. Annesha: I guess continuing on with, I wanted to talk a little bit more about you're at this point where, at least in how much I've gathered from you about how you learned a lot and that initial discovery of all the kind of culture around you, especially being in California, but then you've moved back since, and I kind of want to just know how have you sustained that first initial understanding, and how have you continued that in your day-to-day life? Or how do you, I guess, keep your culture alive on a day-to-day basis? Lori: Yeah. Well, do I keep, well, the thing that I was able to inherit from my grandma, because she was not much of a talker. She didn't sit around and tell us stories.

00:13:43.000 - 00:15:47.000

Lori: As a matter of fact, most of the time we spent with her was in the kitchen, and we loved it. Me and my sister — my sister's two years older than me. My mom was a teen mom, so when she got pregnant with us both, she was still living at my grandma's house, in her own mom's house. So she would go to work and we'd stay all day with my grandma. And then my grandma eventually, when we were five, left Houston and moved to the country after my grandpa died. So all the time we were spent with her, it was always in the kitchen. It was always watching her do tortillas or breads or guisadas or whatever she was making. But the thing that I inherited from her was time in the kitchen, the passion in the kitchen, just watching her hands move when she was working with the masa and everything. The way she did everything was a phenomenon to me because it was so effortless, yet so masterful. When she passed, I inherited her molcajete. Me and my sister went into her kitchen, and mom said, well, take whatever you feel like you want to take. My sister got the comal and I got the molcajete, so I took that, well, I didn't take it with me to California. Later when I realized I wasn't coming back, I asked my mom to send it so it was with me there. Annesha: And what is that? If I can ask for clarification? Lori: Sure. The comal that my sister took, it's an iron pan. It's flat, it doesn't have a curve upward, like a sarten would have a curve upward like a pan, whereas the comal is just flat. The one she took was round, because there’s oval ones too. And then the molcajete, I took that one, and that is the volcanic rock with the ball. It's like a pestle and mortar. Annesha: Yeah.

00:15:47.000 - 00:17:24.000

Lori: Yeah. Annesha: Great. So I was wondering if you have any specific memories attached to food growing up? I can tell that food has been an important way for you of learning about your culture as well, even if it's in a nonverbal way, which I think is really cool. So yeah, if you have any specific memories that stand out to you or holidays or just favorite meals or your favorite meal growing up or now. Lori: I'll say anything my grandma made tasted amazing. Lori: When I was with my mom, she was a single mom, so she cooked really fast to just feed us. It wasn't the same when we went to go with grandma. It was like when I was with my mom's, I was like, I don't want potatoes. I don't like potatoes, but when I go to my grandma's, I would eat them up. It was like potatoes were the best thing on the planet because the way she made it and the love she put into it and the seasoning and everything, it was just different. And so the mindset in the kitchen was different. My mom did her best. She was working with what she had, but it was just different with my grandma. And so yes, anything she ever made, I loved. And my favorite thing was watching her bake in the kitchen and just watching how effortless she did everything. Just her hands moving, she didn't measure anything — she just, it was so, just, it was masterful.

00:17:24.000 - 00:20:36.000

Lori: And the way she turned the bowl to, just everything, it seemed like she was a master of her craft, and she was. So she would let us jump in and maybe do a twist, make a twist on a bread, and throw us some cinnamon and sugar on it, or she would let us roll out a tortilla and we'd do it. It never turned out like hers. So just hands-on in the kitchen. And she didn't really say a lot. She just showed, she just showed us. I think part of that was because her English was okay and my Spanish was not okay. Lori: For some reason, anytime she'd say anything to me in Spanish, I shut down. I just was like, what? Or I wouldn't even say that, I was just dumb faced, and then she'd try to say it in English, and then I would be like, oh, okay. But I mean calabaza con pollo, which is chicken with squash, carne guisada, which I didn't even know these were even called these things back then. She just made them, and later I learned what they were called. When I left Texas and went to California, I learned what they were called, because I guess I didn't care. It was just she's cooking it, I'm eating it. It's amazing. Yum. I didn't ask her what anything was called. So yeah, those were my very favorite dishes when she made those two dishes. But in the holidays, like Christmas or Thanksgiving, there was tamales around. My aunts would make them. All her kids, s he had 13 kids. So it was awesome to be around that many amazing people. So yeah, those were my favorite dishes. Annesha: Yeah. And when did you get into cooking yourself? Lori: When I turned 19, I decided to go to cosmetology school because I was definitely only doing riffraff during my teenage years. So I finally realized, oh, I have to do something. So I went into cosmetology and they helped me get housing with a roommate, and I had an apartment then. Well after that, actually after me and that person were not rooming anymore, I had to get my own apartment and it was in the same building. But anyways, I realized, oh, I don't have anything. I have to cook for myself. And I remember the first thing I tried to make was chicken and rice, and I failed. Rice is really hard. It's really hard. But I watched my grandma do it, but it wasn't as easy as she made it look. And the chicken, it was okay, but that's the first. So I was 19 when I first started to try on my own because I kind of had to like cook cook, not ramen, like cook. Yeah, it was 19.

00:20:36.000 - 00:23:04.000

Annesha: Definitely relate for sure. But have you gotten, I guess, more into cooking since then? What's been your journey with food and cooking and everything? Lori: Absolutely. There's a lot of territory that I do not venture into. I know where my wheelhouse is and where it isn't. I don't bake. I just don't. And the reason is I don't like following instructions. Growing up, watching my grandma not follow instructions made me feel really resistant to doing so when it came to cooking. So baking, you do have to do that. Even though she didn't, for some reason, she just knew. So I don't bake, but I do everything in the sarten in the pan, just like she did. I don't make tortillas. She would make flour tortillas, even though I heard later that her mom would make corn, but I didn't try that. I think I tried it once, maybe twice, and I was like, I can't get it. But now I make tortillas. I did earlier, but they're with corn. I'll tell you more about that because it's easy. You just add water, you add masa, you mix it to the right proportion, and then after they've set, you roll it out. But with flour, I found it more complex because you need so many more ingredients. I was like, ah. So yes, I do cook a lot and I have three molcajetes now. Lori: I only cook with iron skillets. So yeah, I cook a lot. But I don't do, I'm not going to make tamales. To me, I'm like, that's not something you just do on your own. I live alone. So I feel like that's a group effort. So I don't really do that. But yeah, I do cook, I cook with my grandma in mind all the time, and when I'm done cooking it, in my mind I think, oh, she would've liked this. Lori: I always, I'm listening for her approval or for her, whatever she would think, and if I taste it, I’ll be like, oh, she wouldn't have liked this. I don't even like this. So yes, I do hear her in the back of my mind nodding. It's more like I see her nodding or not nodding.

00:23:04.000 - 00:24:30.000

Annesha: Yeah. That's awesome. I can totally understand. Lori: Yeah. Annesha: What's your favorite dish that you like to cook now for yourself, that you enjoy a lot to cook? Lori: I would have to say, hands down, is beans. I am really good at making a pot of beans. They always come out delicious. No matter how much effort I put into them, they're always delicious, and so I always keep those on hand. But when I really want to cook, I think, right now, I like to make picadillo, but I use bison meat. We didn't have that growing up, but now that I know about it, I exchanged that for the ground beef and it's delicious. So I really like that. I do love making calabaza con pollo. I just don't eat as much chicken now as I used to. So it kind of varies depending on how my diet fluctuates. And of course, making chile , making the salsa in the molcajete. I love doing that. Sometimes I find myself cooking when I really need space, and I didn't make the connection until later that I was like, I'm really feeling in my feels, and I find myself cooking. I'm like, oh, I think this is a thing. It's a comfort.

00:24:30.000 - 00:25:55.000

Annesha: Yeah. Lori: Yeah, Annesha: Definitely, I can tell from the memories you've associated with it with your grandma, which is awesome. For sure. Cooking can be really powerful way of storytelling as well. Lori: Yes, it is. Yeah. I want to side note, I did tell my — I sat about a week ago with my mom and three other aunts, three of the tias, and I said, “Hey, I'm going to do this interview.” And they're like, okay. I go, can I just read you some of the questions? And they're like, sure. And they were at the table just doing a puzzle. They love to put puzzles together, so that's their point while they talk about life or just be silent. So I read some of the questions and I said, you know what? I'm just going to read the questions and see what your answer is. That just kind of smoothed out that way. And they started answering, and I really found that their answers were the same as mine when it came to what's the cultural connection. They also, too, were very, very separated from who they were and their ancestry, their history, and they had some very disheartening things to say about that separation.

00:25:55.000 - 00:27:36.000

Lori: A lot of the answers were, I don't know. I don't know. We never did or we never knew. It was just definitely a story of separation and of hardship and that, and they didn't really come alive in the questions until the cultural aspect of what parts of your culture, and it's really how much they had to think about it. And before they could find a spot, they really landed in the kitchen as well. And then they came alive, and I was like, oh my God. I was like, this is crazy. This is the one thing that connected us when there was no other leaf extending, and it's a beautiful thing, but it's like bittersweet beautiful. Annesha: Beautiful. Yeah, I totally understand that. I think food is simple, but it's a lot that you can do with it, especially when it's affiliated and tied mentally to family. It's a sense of grounding, which I can definitely understand. And if you have any other stories related to food, I would love to hear all of them for sure. We can talk about food more. Lori: Okay. Okay. I'd have to give that some thought. Annesha: Yeah, no worries. We can also come back to it because I want to give you a chance to talk about culture and community a little bit as well. I'm curious, has food ever been a community for you for besides close family? Have you ever shared culture or anything like that over food any other ways?

00:27:36.000 - 00:30:43.000

Lori: I can remember times where there was a potluck where I'd have to bring a dish, and I remember people really being surprised who made this, and I was like, me. And they're like, what! I remember one barbershop I worked at, we all went to do a Christmas thing, and they're like, okay, everybody brings something, or a Thanksgiving thing or something like that. I was like, all right, well, I'll make some dressing, because I just knew, okay — after California, I moved to New York and I was there for three years. So at the time I was trying, the farther I got from Texas, the stronger I was pulling myself culturally to who I was. It was like the pool just got stronger, my dreams got stronger the farther I got, and it was really bizarre. I could just tell. I was like, I could just tell New York's going to be the place that catapults me back to Texas. Lori: I don't know why I thought that, but while I was there, I was really trying to pull in a lot of who I am through food, and so I found myself making collard greens, and I was like, I don't even remember grandma making collard greens. And I called my mom. I'm like, I was like, did you ever make collard greens? She's like, oh, yeah, she did all the time. I was like, what? I don't remember that. But there's this Southern aspect too, of what we're making. It's definitely not just tamales, and it's definitely the way my grandma made Turkey dressing was just phenomenal, delicious, amazing. So I asked my mom, then when I was in New York, I was like, tell me a recipe. And she's like, okay. And she told me everything and wrote it down, and I made it. It was soul food. It was soul food for sure. Lori: It was delicious. And I shared that at the table with my partner at the time in New York, and it was like we'd have people over there and they'd be like, what? Who made this? You eat like this every day? I'm like, no. I was like, I could really feel the passion that had been handed down to me in the kitchen when I would cook for people. And to me it was just trying to, connecting to, what I had, but it was when other people would eat it that I would really see the effect. I mean, I was loving it, but when other people ate it, they were like, what? So yeah, at that barbershop too, I had brought the dressing that my grandma made, and well, I made it, but you know what I mean . And they were like, what? This is soul food. How are you making? I was like, I don't know. My grandma taught me how to cook. She didn't teach me all those recipes, but it was the passion, and I don't even know if passion's the right word, but it was just she was fully in the kitchen when she was in the kitchen, even if she was halfway there, because that was just where this fire came up in her. Lori: That's how she showed her love, really. That's what it is. That's how she showed her love.

00:30:43.000 - 00:31:57.000

Annesha: That's awesome. That's great. What was her favorite dish, I guess, to make for you specifically, if you can remember? Lori: I mean, I don't really remember her favorite dish, and she never said her favorite dish, and I never asked, what's your favorite dish? But I know she was always making flour tortillas. She always had a little container on the stove of bacon grease, and she would take from that and cook anything she was making, whether it was kind the carne guisada or anything she was making, she'd start out by putting that bacon grease on there, and I never knew what it was until later, actually. I just would watch her and just look around. All her spoons were all old and wooden and just all of her kitchen stuff was just so perfect, I don't know. It's picture perfect, in the way of memory, perfect. It wasn't like crispy clean. All her stuff was clean, but it wasn't new stuff. It was just very lived in stuff that all this amazing food came out of. I never asked her her favorite. I don't think anybody ever told me. Annesha: No worries. That's awesome. Lori: Yeah.

00:31:57.000 - 00:35:31.000

Annesha: Yeah. I guess the next category I kind of want to talk about is art. Kind of tangential, I guess, to food in a way. But yeah, I wanted to know, does art in any other forms play a role in your life, and if so, can you talk about that a little? Lori: Art plays a huge role in my life. I've always been very creative. As far as growing up, I asked this question to my aunts and they were like, no, never any art. And they argued with each other. They're like, what? Aunt Rose? You're always doing this. And they're like, you wrote poems. And she also sews, and she made me a quilt. It's a different kind of art than I'm doing. I don't make blankets, but I mean, she made me an amazing quilt with what you call the bear claw design. She said that's what it was, and I can see it looks like a claw. Lori: And she also makes, every year she makes tamales and she sells them. She's got her own little side business going on. So it's a different kind of creativity that comes out of our family. My mom loves photography. She also is really into interior design and making sure things feel a certain way in the room. As far as my grandma feeling like, was she creative? She sewed all of their clothes growing up, so that might've been a little more out of necessity versus, like, I'm an artist. I don't think she was thinking that, but I don't know what she was thinking. It was necessity. They grew up really poor. Thirteen kids is a lot of people to cover for, so that's what my mom said. So all of our clothes were handmade by mom. So I feel like her creativity and any art she did just, it was like everything she touched because it had to be, and she was always in the garden planting. So for me, not having grown up poor, we had more than they had. Lori: We didn't really lack for anything with whatever we didn't have, we really didn't lack for anything. So I guess for me, I could be more, I'm an artist, right, and yeah, I was always drawing. The family found out pretty fast that I was drawing stuff that was funny. I would be like, oh, look, I just drew Uncle Peewee. And they're like, ah, that looks just like him. Oh my God. So because they were laughing, I'd be like, I draw everybody, ah, that looks just like him. I put something funny on everybody that stood out and I would draw them, and they're cracking up so bad, and they're like, they would, yeah, they were like, oh, make so-and-so. It's their birthday. Make 'em a card. So I'd make 'em a card and I'd put funny stuff, just making stuff up like their horoscope that I just made up, stuff like that. So there came a time where I was like, I don't want to make a birthday card. They're like, come on. I was like, alright, so I’d draw it real fast because I love making people laugh. I love drawing. It was fun. So later I got into guitar and playing music, and then I got very emo. My version of art was always drawing, painting, or music for the most part.

00:35:31.000 - 00:37:06.000

Lori: But also I have an uncle that plays guitar and he also, oh yeah, later I did get into carving, and my uncle also is a carver, and I didn't really know that until I came back to Texas, although my uncle, he would use a chainsaw. He would carve something with a chainsaw. I'm like, you're crazy. But I was carving things with a dremel. I was a little more safe about it. So yeah, there are some things that run in the family that we're all doing a little bit like the guitar, the carving. But other than that, I mean, growing up, no one just said, here's the thing we do. It wasn't passed down in that fashion. Annesha: It’s just shared creativity. Lori: Correct. And I think the thing that after asking my mom and my aunts all these questions, I was like, you know what? I think the one thing that we didn't really talk about that was such a great thing about our family is we have an insanely hilarious family. Our humor charts, and that's how we coped with the things that we didn't know how to cope with. It was just laughter every direction you can think of. And we made fun of words. We made fun of people. We made fun of ourselves. We made fun of each other. It was all fun to us because there was a lot of hard stuff in there. Annesha: That's wonderful.

00:37:06.000 - 00:37:48.000

Lori: I was surprised no one became a comedian. Annesha: It's so funny. I think that's great having really happy memories of laughter to remember and look back at from your family. Lori: I feel very blessed in that way because you could easily look at our family and see a lot of problems. There's a lot. There's a lot. You could easily just walk away with that and say mmm, but there was just, I chose to see all the beauty in it because there was so much of it. Annesha: I can understand that. Thank you for sharing all that with us.

00:37:48.000 - 00:40:12.000

Lori: Absolutely. Annesha: So can you tell me about maybe a specific art piece that you're particularly proud of, or have you shared with people in some way or you would be excited to share with people if you haven't yet or anything like that? Lori: Yeah, absolutely. When I was 20 and I moved down to South Texas, I thought I was rich because I had saved $500, and I was like, I'm literally rich. So I was like, man, what am I going to do with all this money? And I was like, you know what? I know what I'm going to do. I'm going to go to Michael's and buy some paints and some canvas, and that is what I did. And so I was like, okay, so that was my moment where I was like, I'm skipping from drawing into painting. And so then I decided to become a painter. So everything I've ever painted I'm really proud of, and I've sold some paintings over the years, mostly to friends and family. But in any case, I've always been proud to see the work that came out. Because it ’s so interesting to see it go from nothing to something and just see what comes out of your mind. Lori: Especially when I would free paint and I wouldn't plan anything. It would just come out and be like, wow. So I loved doing that, and it made me feel like I wasn't sure if I was a painter or really embodying what a painter is. It seemed like two different things. I was almost watching a movie of myself painting, so then I would try to dress like a painter, whatever that meant. But it was fun in any case to play with identity in that way. So I think the most painting that I'm currently the most proud of is one that was for the Mexican Museum here in Austin. They did a thing where they asked people to buy a, it's not particle board, it's something else. I forget what you call it — not cork board, not particle board. It's some kind of hard gesso surface.

00:40:12.000 - 00:43:25.000

Lori: And they were doing a thing to help raise money, you know, come buy one of these boards and then paint on it, and here's the topic that we want everybody to paint and then turn it in and we'll post it in the Mexican Museum. In all proceeds, you could choose to keep it or you could choose to let the museum keep it, but everything that's for sale will be for sale for a hundred dollars. So I knew right away, okay, my piece is going to sell for a hundred dollars if it sells, but what I chose to paint at that moment, I don't actually remember the title of the entire event, but I feel like it had to do with cultural, something cultural, a cultural memory or cultural something connecting with cultural. And I was like, you know what? I know what I'm going to do. I already knew the title of the painting, so I did that. Lori: The title of the painting is Tortillas are Made Out of Stardust and Water. So that's a stranger story of how that came into my mind because it wasn't my idea. Something outside of me said it. And I was like, what was that? I wrote it down and I was like, that is the strangest thing I've ever heard, but it sounds kind of cool. So I had it in my mind that I was going to do something with it, maybe a book or I don't know. But when the Mexican Museum put out that call, I said, you know what? I'm going to paint the title. I'm going to paint the cover of that book that I haven't written yet. So I did. I painted the cover and it was really, really cool. I got it in my mind and I did it, and it was really simple painting, very simple, but the fact that I just heard something, downloaded it, kept the idea, put it out there, and then it was displayed here in Texas in a place as official as the Mexican Museum was just like, I did that. Lori: And what it was was a painting of, okay, pretty much outer space, like the dark abyss of outer space. And then it was the outline, just an outline of my grandma's silhouette and her hands, and she had a masa ball of tortillas, how she goes like this, and she's pressing on the masa ball to form it, to set it down and let it rest. So it’s her hands forming the masa ball. And so it's just in a steel motion like this, and you could see her apron and just barely her outline. And then there's a stack of tortillas right here, and that's all it was. And you could see little stars shining in the backgrounds because she's really just how you imagine, the Big Dipper, the little dipper. There's enough of a star outline that you’re, like, it's there. So it’s kind of like that a little bit. Annesha: That's insane. That's crazy. That's awesome. You, as you're talking through and I can literally see it, there's just so many attention to so many little details that I can literally just imagine it. That sounds actually wonderful.

00:43:25.000 - 00:44:09.000

Lori: Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I really enjoyed the process of coming up with that idea. That's really what it was about for me. It wasn't about anything else but the process and honoring what I had heard and honoring my grandma and just putting it down. Annesha: That's so cool. Yeah. Lori: Thank you so much. And then my mom called, she said, did it sell yet? Did it sell? I said, nah. She goes, well, I'm going to buy it because I need to keep that in the family. I was like, oh, she, I want to keep it for my niece or for her grandkid, for my niece , so she bought it, and so I was like, alright, great. Annesha: I was going to say, it's wonderful that that is staying with the family. That seems like a very good embodiment of your grandmother.

00:44:09.000 - 00:44:54.000

Lori: Thank you. I appreciate that. Yes. So that's the one I'm the most proud of, Annesha: As it should be, for sure. It was great. Lori: Yeah, thank you. Annesha: I guess I want to talk about maybe another time, because I had a question about any specific moment that you've really connected with your heritage or expressed something deeply personal, but I think this is a good story about that. But if you have anything else that's similar, another story, another artwork that you'd like to talk about that, in the context of this question, I'd love to hear that as well.

00:44:54.000 - 00:48:30.000

Lori: You know, I was very lucky to get to talk about at a class I did, it was like a healer's class, but I was really lucky to be prompted to by the instructor to talk about my love for molcajetes, and she actually called me a collector. She's like, she's a collector. And I was like, okay. So she said, tell them about your stories. And I just, in her mind, I have stories. In my mind, here's what it is. I said, okay, I wouldn't call myself a collector. So here's what happened. So I went back and I told how my grandma had passed away, and then how I had gotten the molcajete and my sister had gotten the comal and I just that cherished that molcajete, and then my friend in South Texas at the time, she saw that I loved them, and she just took note of that. Lori: Moving forward in time, I moved to New York and she said, you know what? I have something for you that's a gift for you. And she said, I'm going to send it to you. She goes, my uncle went to Mexico, and I said, I need a molcajete . It's for my friend Lori. So she got it. She did the whole seasoning of it. She threw rice in there and ground it down to kind of cover the volcanic holes in there, and she sent it to New York, and I was like, oh my God. It's the heaviest package I’ve ever gotten. But I was so, it felt so good for somebody to see that I was so into that and to give me that gift. But when I moved back to Texas, I don't know my dad's side of the family and I didn't grow up with them. I've met them, but you know. But so when my other grandma that I never grew up with passed away, I went to his house and I was asking, can I see photos? Lori: Can you show me anything? Because I don't know anything about the family. He goes, oh, he goes, and somehow or another he said, yeah, I have some of her stuff in the kitchen there. If you see anything you like, you can take it. And I opened up the cupboard at the bottom. First thing I see is this molcajete, and it's just so small and not so small, but it was so humble. And I was like, is that molcajete hers? He's like, yeah, you can have it. I was like, I'll take it. So then I was able to get her molcajete too, which I cherish, and I still have it. So that was a beautiful moment. So at that time, now I have molcajetes , right? It's kind of wild. It's not like I have some big family I'm feeding. It's just me. Then moving forward, I had a partner that when we broke up, it was a difficult time, but she also saw that I love molcajetes, and I guess as a parting gift, she just gave me a little molcajete. It was literally this small. It was so small, and it belonged to her grandma, and she said, here, you can take this. And I was in my feels, so I was like waah. But at the same time, I look at it and I use it and it's one of my favorite. It was so beautiful, and I was just like, what a gift. I didn't mean to collect so many. It just happened. And they're prized possessions, and I use them as much as I can. So somehow I've become a molcajete lover. Annesha: Yeah, that's really cool that you have unintentionally begun to collect them. The question for you is, who do you envision yourself passing those onto?

00:48:30.000 - 00:50:10.000

Lori: That's a great question. I feel like the one that my friend Diane sent to me is rightfully, I mean, they're all rightfully mine, I guess. But I heard a saying yesterday, it’s “everything is for you, but nothing is yours.” And I think that's really profound. But I envision, I only have one niece, so I envision being able to pass her down either of those, but I do want to return the one to my ex-partner. I do. One day I've been thinking I want to one day say like, “Hey, I know that you gave this to me, but your grandma already passed away, and this is precious,” and part of me wants to just inquires he wants it returned because that way she could pass that down in her lineage. So there's that with that one and with my grandma's that I didn't grow up with, I don't really know. I don't know because I don't have this long line of children in front of me. So I'm absolutely willing to pass it down to whomever it makes sense to, or whomever finds a love for it, to be honest, that's the most thing. If you have a connection and a love for it, boy, you sound like the right person. So whether it's a cousin or something like that, that's younger, you know. Annesha: Yeah, Lori: Totally. Annesha: So can you see yourself re-gifting them as well, maybe to family?

00:50:10.000 - 00:52:21.000

Lori: Yeah. A part of that story too that is really bizarre is that, so when I still only had one molcajete, which was my grandma's that I grew up with, I was living in San Francisco, and at the time I was learning way too much about politics and all the things that were wrong with this country, and part of me was overwhelmed. I said, you know, I'm going to leave. I don't want to be in this country anymore. I'm going to go to Mexico. And at the time, I was renting a room from a family, from Mexico, from Guadalajara, and they're like, we have a house down in Guadalajara. If you want to go there, you're more than welcome. I was like, yes, that's what I'm going to do. I'm going to run away from the US and go live there. So I said my goodbyes to my mom. I'm like, I'm, I'm leaving. All of us showed up. My brother and my sister, we all ate, and they're like, bye. Lori: I took, of course, everything you would expect you would take. I took a little bit of clothes, my guitar, and a molcajete. I don't know why I did that. But so I did that and I ended up in Mexico with those items, and I don't know how long I lasted there, but I'm going to say maybe a month, and I got really sick, and I didn't want any medicine because in my mind I'm like, I'm natural now. I don't take medicine. So I got sicker faster. And so eventually my sister's like, they're like, we got to get you back here. You don't look good. And I was like, I think I was going cuckoo because I was so dehydrated. And so they're like, okay, they put me on a flight and they brought me back. And because I wasn't really coherent that well, I didn't realize until a month later I was looking for a molcajete and realized like, oh my God, I left it in the house. So my grandma's molcajete has returned to Mexico. So my mom was like, oh, man. And we were thinking and we're like, you know what? It kind of seems like a full circle. Lori: So we didn't feel like it was a huge loss. We just felt like, well, it just seemed full circle and we made our peace with it. Annesha: Yeah, I'm sorry about that. That sucks.

00:52:21.000 - 00:54:43.000

Lori: It's okay. It's crazy that now I have three and I had one. Yeah, yeah. Annesha: Wow. Thank you so much for sharing all these stories. So I keep forgetting what we've been doing the questions cause I get so, in the— There's a lot of magic in my life with connecting culturally and connecting to what I know and connecting to what I don't know. There's been a lot of magic in it, whether through dreams or whether through beautiful gifts like molcajetes or whether through food. There's just been a lot of magic. So as much as that I haven't been able to really fully connect with where I come from. It doesn't feel like the gaping hole that it could feel like that because there's still so much magic involved. So I take that. Annesha: Kind of on this, I guess, similar topic is I wanted to ask if you were spiritual in any way, and if you'd like to talk about your spirituality a little bit. Lori: Yeah, absolutely. Spirituality. I don't consider myself religious. Growing up, my grandma was Catholic, and I think by the time I was a little bit older, she became Christian. And we weren't really, we were kind of pretend Christians or Catholics. We just had the title, but not the practice, I guess. But one thing I did see is whenever we'd stay at my grandma's house, if by chance I got up really early, which almost never happened, I would walk out of the room and I'd look and I would see my grandma on her knees at her bed doing her morning prayers. And that was something very religious that she did. Although I wouldn't call her religious. It was a ritual that she had and there was this love there about who she was. Like I said, she expressed her love through just cooking and the care and stuff. So there were times where there was twice that I can remember where she did a limpia on me, and she, which one came first?

00:54:43.000 - 00:59:23.000

Lori: I'm not sure, but I remember one in the backyard when we lived out in Katy, right outside of Houston, something was going on, which I will not explain here, but I was acting a fool. My mom didn't know what was going on with me and I was sick. So my grandma took me in the backyard and put a sheet over me and then had me walk in the shape of a cross and then took a broom and was doing something and, I don't know exactly what she was doing cause I had a sheet over my head, but she was saying prayers under her breath, and I was walking like a zombie thinking if they only knew, there's nothing wrong with me, it's just that I did something stupid, but I wasn't really computing what is she doing though? Lori: I was just felt like, this is funny, I'm pulling the wolves over their eyes. So that's one memory I have. And the other one is when a very, very bad thing happened to me. My mom took me to her house, to my grandma's house and had me on the bed, and my grandma gave, she had the huevo, the egg, and she had a wet cloth, I think she had a wet cloth, and she was maybe rubbing my head. I'm not really remember, but she was putting the egg all over my body, touching my skin just gently and saying prayers underneath her breath. So I couldn't hear what she was saying, but I do remember getting that, and I remember her telling me and my mom that I had susto, which means fear or fright. Lori: So the combination of things. And I would see my grandma, also too, had a Bible. So the combination of seeing her pray, having a Bible, not really going to church, but also seeing her do those practices was kind of the variety, the variety that I saw. Later on when I was 20, I did join the church, but that's because I was asked to over and over. What I really, my goal was really to do, was to get close to God because I realized it was a miracle that I was alive. So I did have a church stint for four years, five years maybe, and then I came out of that, and that's a whole different episode. But today, what I practice is definitely, well, from that episode that I say is I did have to work to undo a lot of the, I feel like that was a very Christianization moment of my life where I got indoctrinated with a lot of stuff and it made me see myself differently. So I had to unsee those things or unlearn those things. Lori: It took a lot of time, but I stayed with, you know, one thing I always believed in and trusted in was prayers. One thing I always believed in and trusted in was protection. Once I got to California, I knew for sure my grandma was with me. It was just a knowing. It was crazy how I didn't really have that when I was in Texas. After she passed, it was like I forgot and then moved towards the church thing again. But once I left the church and left Texas, it was like instant. My grandma's with me. She made her presence known too in my dreams. So that was the thing that I carry with me was that. So in current times, I still know my grandma's with me. Also, too, one practice that I have that I love that I learned about when I was about twenty six or seven was Dia de los Muertos, that we did not grow up with that, the Day of the Dead, but it just came on the scene in my life and I was like, wow, this is profound and it ’s everything that I want, it just felt, felt good. And so since then, I have been making ofrendas and I always put my grandma on it. And so my practice now is just prayers, meditation, and just giving thanks really. And I do burn burnables, whether it's palo santo or keeping a candle lit, things like that. So I think the spoken word is mostly what I do, spoken word and intention.

00:59:23.000 - 01:00:51.000

Annesha: That makes a lot of sense. Speaker 3: Yeah. Annesha: I'm wondering, is there any specific landmarks in nature or anything like that that hold any significance to you or do you enjoy being out in nature or have any connections or feel any connections to it? Lori: Yes. I love nature. I love nature a lot. As far as the landmark goes, there's a cemetery here in Austin where my grandma's mother was born, not born. She wasn't born at the cemetery. My grandma that I grew up with, her mom is buried there, sorry, her mom is buried there. And I didn't find out until I was barely moving back to Texas. So I probably found out in 2014 or 2013, right before I moved back here. And I think that's about the same time that my aunt found out. So she told me as we went there, and I didn't know that five years later I'd end up moving to Austin. So, that landmark in Austin is hugely important to me, and I try not to spend too much time there, because when I was very, very sad one year, I spent way too much time at the cemetery, so I try not to go too frequently, but it is a really beautiful place with really beautiful history that cemetery. So yeah.

01:00:51.000 - 01:02:58.000

Annesha: Yeah. That sounds beautiful. Lori: Yes. Annesha: So I guess the next topic I wanted to talk about is broader health and wellbeing. And this could be more of a sensitive topic, so I just want to let you know you're able to share however much you want to, and you can leave whatever it is that you'd like a little bit more ambiguous. But the topic I want to talk about is have you specifically had any struggles with mental health and more about how that's impacted your identity and how you've kind of coped with that kind of where you are now, and just kind of however you'd like to discuss the topic. Lori: I think the first thing to note is that I would never say that I was having mental health problems because that was not necessarily language that was used when I was growing up. So I could definitely cry and say, I got a problem right now, but I wouldn't call any of my problems mental health problems. Now, I might refer to it that way, but it was never that way growing up. And like I said, I think the church and going through that and realizing, okay, yes, I'm gay, and for some reason this is a thing with people, I didn't think it was a thing. I just thought it was normal as anything else. It became a thing once the church came into my life. So when I left the church, I had to figure that out. Where do I stand with myself? So leaving to California was helpful.

01:02:58.000 - 01:06:01.000

Lori: I think that I was definitely having struggles, emotional struggles, trying to figure that out or undo a mindset of where I felt like I was wrong or bad or unsaved or all this stuff. So I had to do that, and that was hard, but one day at a time, and I worked it out for the most part. I mean, it stays the thing you work out. It doesn't just work out on Thursday, it stays the thing you work out, but it's a lot less work over time. So yeah, so that was a thing, but I just feel like because I don't have kids, I think that I have too much time on my hands to think about myself. Lori: And I think that that does feed into, because I see like, a friend of mine has three kids and a husband, and she can hardly get time for herself. So she's constantly with her mind on that. And I noticed the difference in us. I'm constantly with my mind on me, and it does change. So I try to go outside as much as possible every day, at least be in the sunshine, because I really do need to. That helps me remember how beautiful life is and to not focus on deficit, to not focus on lack, but to focus on just this moment. So that's my whole method is this moment as much as possible and being outside and just giving thanks. So yes, yes, mental health and emotional health has played a huge role in who I am. But I'm super grateful that I deep dive into music. Lori: I deep dive, I've used painting, I've used writing. I've also been writing since I was a teenager. I have had to throw so many books away cause I’m like, I'm traveling with all these books that I wrote. They're just, I'm just like, there's just tons and tons and tons, and I've gone back and read them, and some of them are beautiful and some of them are just plain mopey, and I'm just like, wow, I was really in emotions right then, but that's how I processed everything. And that's how I was able to not carry as much on a daily basis, so yeah. Yeah. I also did later bring in yoga, and that was interesting. That was a beautiful, I really appreciate that. I like ancient, ancient arts like that that help me in the present day to be better centered. Annesha: I understand. That makes sense. Yeah.

01:06:01.000 - 01:08:32.000

Lori: Yes. Annesha: I'd like to talk about community a little, switching gears a little bit away from art. How has your community played a role in your life? You can interpret community however you'd like, broadly or your physical geographic location or, yeah, however you'd like to think about it. Lori: Yeah. I have, how do you say this? I have a relationship to community, I don't know the word I'm thinking of, but, well, I guess what I'm saying is I don't understand what community is that well. Because of how large my family was growing up and how it was all that we did was just family. And then I went to six different elementaries. So we moved around a lot and then I think three or four different high schools. So community was something I didn't understand. So even now, I've been in Austin for seven years. It's the longest I've lived in any city. It's the longest I've done one thing. So now my version of community is expanding and it's mind blowing actually. It really is. So community feels like something that's still, that I don't know how to relate to. So I think I do my best to connect, but I find that I don't want to connect a lot. Sometimes I just want to be kind of alone. So I struggle with what community means to me, so no wonder I can't describe it. Annesha: I think family is kind of the form of community that maybe you feel closest to, and maybe that would be community to you in a way.

01:08:32.000 - 01:12:21.000

Lori: Yeah, and I do want to mention that this was one of the questions that I asked my aunts and my mom, and they were like, we weren't allowed to hang out with other people. As a matter of fact, one of the sadder notes, on one of the sadder notes, my grandpa, their dad, would move them as far away from people as possible because he wanted everybody secluded. His reason is unclear, but so I think that pattern kind of stayed in our family a little bit by us not really having a large friend base, but just having a family base. And of course when I left to California, I had friends, and when I left Houston, I had friends, but I did find it hard to keep friends and to connect with friends because it was not family. Annesha: I guess one of the final questions or categories I want to talk about is safety and wellbeing and your sense of safety. But in your day-to-day life, would you say that you typically feel safe? Or what does looking or feeling safe look like for you? Lori: Everywhere I've lived, I've always just tried to do my best to not stand out so much because especially when I went to California, because I didn't want to look like the visitor because, so I was looking like the visitor for a while, until I started to look around me. So I do try to chameleon into every community that I live in just so that I won't make splashes, I guess. But it's crazy. No matter how much I try to chameleon, I end up looking really different. I'm just like, it's just kind of like that's the way it is. And so I've learned to accept that. And sometimes it feels a little unnerving to go everywhere and catch looks, especially when I'm just trying to look like everyone else, but it just never works out. So feeling safe, I would say I do everything in my power to feel safe, and that means dressing a certain way that makes me feel safe. Lori: That means — it didn't used to be that way though, because I used to drink a lot when I was doing a lot of unsafe activity actually. But you throw caution to the wind when you're drinking that much. Now that I don't drink anymore, my behavior is very different and much safer. There's things that I was doing before that I look at, I'm like, I can't believe I made it through that. So I think I was the unsafe one before, and no matter how much unsafety was around me, I didn't notice it. And by the way, you ain't going to touch me. And by the way, you ain't crossing this barrier because — so I had that amount of maybe false courage through my behaviors. So now I'm just trying to not push the limits on the safety thing. I feel safe enough, I'll put it that way, because I live around a lot of unsafe activity, but I feel safe enough to not say that I feel unsafe.

01:12:21.000 - 01:14:29.000

Annesha: Yeah, that makes sense. Lori: Yeah. Annesha: Okay. So we've kind of hit the ending, ending ish or interview, but I wanted to give you a chance to with one last broader question, kind of maybe gather your thoughts and talk about anything else that we haven't gotten a chance to talk about that you saw from the question sheet or anything that you really wanted to mention today, if there's anything else. But yeah, just as we close, I know a lot of people will be listening to this as well and using this as a way to just learn and hear someone else's experience and story. You never know who could be understanding or resonating with some of the things that you were talking about as well. So I just want to give you the opportunity to talk to those people as well and just share any kind of words of advice or last, final things you'd like to leave us with today. Lori: I really don't have any specific words of advice other than everything that we are is already within us. We really don't have to search outside of ourselves. I mean, we can, but everything is within us already. I don't know, I don't know how much more to find what I'm looking for when it comes to connecting, and I'm not sure how much it's worth it when I have so much already. When my grandma would cook and she'd sit down at the table and then we all finally just eat, she would say, not even the president is eating this good. So with whatever we had and whatever we didn't have, we knew we were rich for what we had created and shared.

01:14:29.000 - 01:15:04.000

Annesha: Well, thank you for sharing some of that with me today. And yeah, just taking the time to tell me a little bit about your life and yeah, just share your story with us. And I hope you really enjoyed this whole process too, and just thank you so much for helping our project. Lori: Thank you, Annesha, I really appreciate your time. Annesha: Thank you. I'm going to go ahead and stop the recording. Lori: Okay.