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Uh, today is August 9th, 2019. My name is Akhil Jonnalagadda. I’m Christina Lee. And we’re here today with Alice Wen.

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Uh, so to start off, when and where were you born? I was born in Taiwan in 1958. Uh did you grow up where you were born, or did you move around when you were growing up? Uh, I was born in Tainan, which is the south of Taiwan and I moved to

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Taipei, which is north of Taiwan when I was 3 years old. And who consists of your family? I have two brothers and two sisters, so I’m the fourth one.

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I have a younger brother. What were your parent’s occupations? My daddy is an engineer and my mom pretty much do everything she could to, you know, to

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provide financial support to the family. My mom does everything. And what kind of values did your parents instill in you and your siblings when you were growing up? I didn’t grow up in a very rich family although it’s not

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very poor , but you know, essentially my mom had to do multiple jobs. Because my father was an engineer, worked for a Japanese company, I think it’s called Mitsubishi, with the three diamonds, , and they

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moved employees around. So even I was raised up in Taipei, I moved around the Taipei area quite a lot. So, wherever we moved to with the company, my mom has to, you know,

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find a job to raise the family. Yeah. What were some of the jobs that your mom took on? Wow, she does everything. I don’t really remember.

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Uh, I know, she went to some manufacturing jobs, but then after work she has to do some work at home like weaving sweaters, making like five

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dollars, Taiwan dollars, per piece, something like that. She does a lot of work and I hardly remember. I just knew my mom very busy, yeah. And she changed jobs quite a lot, you know, moving around

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with my daddy. What language did your parents speak with you when you were home? Taiwanese. Uh, and did you, do you remember what you wanted to be when you grew up?

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I always wanted to be a teacher because at that age, teacher, you know, is everything, is so powerful, is so knowledgeable, and I said, “wow, I want to be a teacher when I grow up and make a

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change.” Do you have any extremely memorable experiences that you were, that you still remember from when you were growing up? Yeah, I remember when we moved to Taipei not long , we had a

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huge flooding in the area we lived, which is like a company’s — or what do you call it? It’s not auditorium, but it’s housing . And I was waken up in the middle of night.

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My daddy carried me on his shoulders and my mom has my little brother and we had to escape to a tall building. And then, from the tall building we see all the animals, pigs and chickens, a lot of furniture

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were flown with the water wave, you know, rain, water. It was scary. And then, we were hungry for like three days. And finally, the company sent a big

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pile of congee, basically it has nothing in it, just the congee. And we all tried to, you know, just, everybody tried to eat a little bit to survive , not hungry to death.

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So, that, that was the scary part. When you see, you know, how powerful the water can carry away everything. And it was the middle of

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the night and I guess, some people did not, you know, escape from the, from the quick flooding. And we stayed near the river, which is Tamsui River in Taipei.

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It was scary. I don’t remember. I was maybe 3 or 5 years old. What was the community or neighborhood that you grew up in like?

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Um, more like old/middle income neighborhood. You know, both parents all need to work, not only day time, and multiple jobs because at that time it was like agricultural era, so

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it’s not fully industrialized work environment. Even my daddy was an engineer working in industry, you know, it’s like kids we all

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need to take care of ourselves, you know because no parents around day or night. And was your family religious growing up? No. Not really. Maybe my parents were Buddhist because I saw my mom, you

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know on every occasion, she would do, you know, pray and then have a festival sometimes, something like that, for the God. Did you have any other uh family traditions whether that be religious or cultural

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that you remember practicing? No, I don’t. No, not really. But it’s like throughout the year so many occasions I had to

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do, I don’t remember the dates. But I know whenever my mom would do it, then she will you know tell us all get ready for it. Yeah. Did you travel much when you were growing up?

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No, I think my first international trip was to US to study abroad. Yeah. When was that? 1983. Right.

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December 1983. I remember it’s December because it was Christmas season. I came like two weeks before school starts, so I can get a feel of what’s the Christmas like in United States

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because it was so, so much of it on TV, all of the news media. I have a college senior. She studied at Salt Lake City, the University of Utah.

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When she knew I’m coming to US, she wrote to me, say hey, you can come over before school starts and we can have Christmas holiday here in Salt Lake City. That really inspired me because I never knew what Christmas is like,

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it’s never snowing in Taiwan. And it was a white Christmas in Salt Lake City in December. And because UU was in quarter system for my college senior so they only get two-week break.

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That’s why I spend my first vacation in Salt Lake City for two weeks. Um was your family supportive of you going to study abroad in

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the United States? Did they have any strong feelings about you going abroad? Well, first of all, they didn’t like it because I’m the first one in my family, you know, get away

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from-from the house or the family and it’s so far away. My mom said, “United States is not a safe place, there are so many crimes going on, you don’t want to go there.” So initially, they all-they all you know

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disapproved me going abroad, but eventually I convinced them. Yeah. What program did you come to study in the United States? It was in meteorology. Yeah. My major, my undergraduate was in atmospheric

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science or physics, like astronomy science, but what we studied, was from the ground surface all the way to space. And I said you know, when I was little, I want to be a teacher,

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but later on, I decided I want to be an astronaut. I think that’s the time the US first launched on the moon. So, that was very inspiring. I wanted to be an astronaut, so I chose that field because

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I was very good at math and physics and I’m not a hardworking student. I don’t like to study or memorizing things, yeah, you heard me. I don’t remember exactly.

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Because when I was little, I was tested in talents. I’m very good at logical, mechanic, and analytical thinking. But I’m very poor at language and memorizing. So I knew that.

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I said, no matter how hard I study, I’ll probably forget it right away. So, I chose to be, you know, a scientist studying physics and math. So, when I applied for the college, I

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chose those specific fields. But I don’t like chemistry, so any fields related to chemistry I don’t want it. So, I really had limited fields to choose , so I

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studied in the atmospheric science for undergraduate and that-that gave me the scholarship to come to the United States. That was at University of Oklahoma, Norman.

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They have five-year research project, I think satellite, some kind of research study. It has a very good grant, so they can offer to give scholarships to

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foreign graduate students. Yeah. And so, what year did you get your undergraduate degree? Uh it was not until January 19th, 1987. And at that time, were there a lot of women in

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science? Not really. I think there were only two female in my graduate study. There was a girl from Korea and we became good friends, because

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we two were the only two foreign graduate students. We both were very poor in English, but she can write her name in Chinese. She cannot read and write, but she can write it, so when we had hard time to communicate,

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because that was our first time came to the United States. Sometimes we are writing in Chinese to communicate. That was-that was very interesting.

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Yeah. So, you did your undergraduate education in Taiwan? How was that experience? Uh, it was difficult and challenging. You know, from high school to college, we all have to take

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nation, nation-wide exam. Depends on your score, and you get to choose which high school or which college you go to. For high school, you know, I went to the best high

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school in Taiwan. And it was in Taipei – Taipei First Girls High. And I was in the science major, so there were only two classes in the

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entire high school. Has two, has the science major. The rest of them are in business, or in medical school.

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Yeah. Since we were in science and engineering classes, when we took the college entrance exam, we got to compete with all the guys. Because most guys they chose engineering or

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scientific kind of majors, because at that time it was easier to get a job. And guys need to get a job in order to have a wife. So we had to compete with.

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I got, not too bad of a score, and I get into a college to study in the field I like. So, I was lucky and it was away from home. Not too far though!

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It was still in the, in the northern part of Taiwan. But at the time, you always wanna get away from home, right? So, we choose the colleges far away from home. Um Taipei’s First Girls High, was that an

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all-girls high school? Yeah, it’s all girls. How did you like that? Uh, good or bad.

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You know, I didn’t really have a strong feeling, because at that time, when you get into that high school, that means you have to study hard to get to the college. So, that was just a stepping stone. Um, and we had a very strict uniform.

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The hair needs to be in the middle of the ear part. It really looks very stupid. And straight hair, and at the middle of the ear, and the skirt has to be long so you look like a nun, you know.

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You’re not attractive to anything at all, so the… So, this is the when you study, study, and study, okay? So, even sometimes we had to take the same bus with the best high school, it’s all men

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high school, and we had to ride the bus together. But we were not allowed to like , not really, no teacher in the bus. But it’s like very strict.

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So if somebody claimed that you were talking to a boy in the male school, you will be in trouble. You will be called to the

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principal’s office and to be interviewed. So, we just know to study, study, and study. But you know, remember the water, the flooding experience ?

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Uh, kind of scary in my mind. So, I did not know how to swim, and I did not want to get into water. But at my high school, it’s required to swim twenty-five feet from this end to that

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end. Whichever way you want to do, you have to swim from that end to that end, it’s like 25 feet. To me, it was very long and I did not know how to swim. I was afraid of water.

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I don’t want to put my head above water. So, I had to take, during the summer break, take the swimming lessons to learn. I finally, I did not raise my head up above the water, I still put my

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head under the water, but I finally managed to swim from that end to that end. That wasn’t a good experience. Um, what did you uh do outside of academics, either in high school or in college? Uh in high school, I studied, I took

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some classes after school to learn how to cook and sewing, and then do floral arrangement and photography. That was my interest, yeah, since I cannot sing, and I cannot

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dance. And was that something that a lot of your friends did or was that something you just really wanted to do and so you—? I really wanted to do, yeah. I didn’t have like the best friend in high school.

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You know, because everybody was studying individually and very hard, and we sort of competing with each other too, you know what I mean? So, we do not have you know, best friend in high

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school. So did you – overall do you think that your experience in school in Taiwan is really different from your experience in school in the States? Oh yes. I came to the United States I didn’t really need to

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study hard because everything I need to learn pretty much all learned it in college already, you know. I don’t want to say in high school because we didn’t really learn that much.

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Well, we learned a lot but mainly for the college entrance exam. That’s the challenging part. If you don’t get to the college, you don’t have a career. You don’t have a job, you don’t have a life, basically.

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In college, I learned a lot. Uh, came here, I basically learned everything I know, but in English. So, that was the challenging part, you know.

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I know the question and know the answer, but how to write the answer in English? That was my major challenge. Did you always want to move to the United States when you were growing up?

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Not really. Not really. The reason I came here. Um, after I graduated from college, I took some job interviews, some of the institutes or the companies they only hire one people and not only you have to

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take academic exam, they also tested you in the IQ. I was lucky you know, for several companies that interviewed me, I was selected as the first choice. But if I took the job that means all my college, you

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know collegemates, they won’t have job because in that field, there’s limited jobs. I took the first one , but I only worked one month then I quit.

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My mom was very mad at me because that was a very “easy” job and that was the reason I quit. Because graduated from college, you studied so hard, you have a dream, you want to apply your knowledge and skills, and you want

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to be able to contribute to the, to the country or the society. The job I took was the Meteorology Center in Air Force. So, every morning,

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there’s a commuter bus come to your home, come to your house to pick you up and take you to work. My job only took me one hour to finish and the rest of the day I just played Ping-Pong with colleague, and

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sometimes took a long hour lunch break, watch movie, shopping around because in the area, there’s a lot of stores. So I didn’t feel challenged you know. I just sit there, and

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chatter with your boss. That really wasn’t what I expected. The pay was really high and really good. That’s why they only hire one.

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So — and at that time, I wrote to my college’s senior. And then, she encouraged me - said why don’t you come study abroad.

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And after that, I decided, “her, there might be something challenging for me to do.” Otherwise, you know, now I had an easy job, nice pay and I didn’t need to spend anything on the

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transportation nor clothes because they gave us uniform too. Also, and then, and then they provided lunch and everything else at the company‘s. That really was a nice

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job to have. Some people work there after college and they doing the military services - that’s a requirement two years.

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So, they all just came to the office and chat with you, you know. So, so I decided — and my mom got into some kind of — how do you call that, like private loan, like if

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your family needs money, and then we will get some like 30 people together, and every month we contribute like $10,000 to you so you have a big chunk of money to pay for college tuition or loan.

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And then, that person, the loaner needs to pay back every month. So my mom got into that program because all my salary, I don’t need to spend much, other than my own outfit after work. And then, worked

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just one month and I quit. And then I went back to school, my college, to be a research associate. And then, to study TOEFL and GRE to prepare to

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take those exams so I can apply for college here. But when you were in Taiwan you — did you study English to get ready to come to the States? Not until I tried to study for the TOEFL, and yeah, and my — you know some of the textbooks we

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used they are in English. We can read and we can read better than writing. But speaking is like ahh... When I came to U, United States, my graduate advisor

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called me Ms. Hu–ang. Because my maiden name is Huang, H-U-A-N-G, and Americans they all separate the vowels. Right, so he always called me Ms.

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Hu–ang. I have no idea he was calling me, because we say Huang together. U and A, but they say Hu– ang. H-U and then A-N-G.

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So, when I studied for TOEFL, I actually took a few times to pass that. And that was one of the major reasons delayed came to US because I cannot pass TOEFL exam at the first time. So, I came here in spring semester, rather

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than most people, they came here in fall because I did not pass to get accepted for fall semester. I came one semester later. Was it difficult to obtain a Visa to come to the United States?

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If you have a scholarship and you get the offer letter, no, not as a graduate student. And, what was your biggest challenge coming to America? Was it the language?

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Was it being homesick? Was there anything else that really challenged you when you moved here? You know, it’s everything. But language and the culture differences and of

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course, the homesick. Like you said, cannot help, but language part and the culture differences, the way we do things in United States is very different from what we do in Taiwan.

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Yeah, Taiwan is more family-oriented and people help each other, but in United States, you’re more independent, you have to do everything , you have to learn and then how to do it.

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Like I never know how to use a screwdriver and you know here, you gotta figure out what’s flat and what’s cross. I still remember one of my jobs, my boss asked me, “Can you give me a flat?” I asked, “what’s flat?” Or, he said “Give me a

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16-ping female, 9-ping male”, something like that. I said, what are you talking about? You know, it’s “the adapter”. At that time, the

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adapter has 16-pin male or female one way or the other. I said I have no idea what you’re talking about. That’s why I said language , you know, because we all call it differently, yeah. Since I never really got hands-on work on any

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part of this. Language took me a while to learn. Remember I said my worst talent is memorizing and language. What was your first impression of the United States and how

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did it compare to the expectations that you had maybe before you got here? My first impression is that this is a big country because Taiwan is small. I came here and then

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realized it’s so diversified uh you know culture. People from all over different places and to learn your background, so we can communicate and get to know each other better so we won’t offend each other.

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You know, that was the biggest challenge and impression. When I first move, when I first came to the United States, it was in Salt Lake City.

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People very nice even in supermarket. I spoke in Chinese, people they answer you in Chinese because I think in Salt Lake City there are a lot of Mormon and they

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go all over the world. And some of them know Chinese. So, that was interesting part. Did I answer your

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question? What was your, the other question? Was it the impression? Okay. I really did not have much expectation other than I want to come here to learn more, and to

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be an astronaut. Um, and everything else we learned it’s more bad things than good things. You know how the TV they all

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report bad things, they don’t report good things. But, there are lots of great things I, I learned before I came to US and I really like it. But, my mom worried about me every day.

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She wanna make sure I still even survive because she thinks United States is a dangerous place. In Taiwan, we really don’t need to

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worry about safety or crime. Crime is not the same kind of crime that will kill your life, that’s what I meant, yeah. That impression that you had when you first came to America, did that change over time as you’ve

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lived here for longer and longer? Like the impression of it being really big or being really diversified, people being really nice? Uh did that change at all the longer you stayed

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here? Uh, no not really. It’s still very interesting place you know for life journey because every day you meet different people and you learn different things.

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And, one major difference. Here is more “me, me, me”. Back in Taiwan, in the culture I grew up with, is more family , it’s all “us”.

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But here, it’s more focused on yourself and that — it took me a long while, many years to learn how to think for myself, do things for myself, rather than think of

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others. Uh, so you came to the states because you wanted to be an astronaut. And then you eventually you ended up working for NASA. So how did that happen? Oh, that’s after I got my first

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Master’s degree. It’s in Meteorology. And, at the time I graduated is about the same time my husband finished his Ph.D.

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degree in Salt Lake City. Oh, I missed that part! When I came to US, to have two-week vacation. I guess it was, it was the fate,

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because my college’s senior, she had a boyfriend. It was her and her boyfriend, plan on picking me up at the airport. But, for

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whatever reasons, her boyfriend’s car just broke down and could not make it. So, she asked one of her friend to come to the airport, picked me up.

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I guess, from the time picked me up and till I left, we became good friends. And that was my future husband. So what did I— so that’s how I met my husband in Salt Lake City. Remember I studied in Norman?

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So after two weeks, I have to go to the school. But then, after then, every quarter, his school was in quarter system, I had a semester-system school. We had to find a common break and then we visited each other.

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And when I graduated in January, in March he got a post-doctoral job in Pittsburgh. So, we moved together to Pittsburgh. Oh, I’ve also missed the other

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part - we married! When we married, when we’re both students in graduate school. And the reason is funny, the

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reason he married me is because he was broke. Because we were, we were apart, he was a graduate student and I was a graduate student. We both didn’t have much money.

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We came to United States probably with US$1,500 in the pocket, right. Every month, we got scholarship that was enough for tuitions and meals and dorm, no problem.

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So, we had savings to buy car and have vacations. But when I mentioned that part - he broke, is because we both found common break to tour around the United States.

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We both like nature resources, so we often took a break to visit national parks. I think that was the period I visited most of the national parks in the United States.

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And he had spent all his scholarship, not only on tuition and living, and also on vacations, and on phone calls - at that time that’s long distance call charge if you remember. Unlike now, even worldwide call is free, but back at that

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time international call is like one dollar per minute, and there’s long distance call charge too. So, he broke, he said - let’s get married. So, we married two years later, even we both were still in school.

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So when he graduated from his Ph.D., I got my Masters. I couldn’t continue the Ph.D. program because he got a job as post-doctor job in Pittsburgh. So, we moved there together.

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Well, since there was no meteorology or NASA or anything like that in Pittsburgh, so I start to look for jobs and lucky! I got a job in Greenbelt, Maryland. But, I

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got pregnant. And I was really sick in , you know. And so I wrote a letter to employer NASA and said you know, you know— since

00:34:26.040 - 00:34:39.640

married, this is the first time we really live together. You know and I was pregnant, didn’t feel like I can perform the job at the best I could.

00:34:39.820 - 00:34:50.480

“Can you put the offer on hold until I deliver the baby?” And they were nice enough to say, “Yes”. So, I put the job offer on hold

00:34:50.480 - 00:35:02.640

for a year after you know I had labor, and then I took the job at NASA. But, I didn’t work long. Yeah so, so your job was in Maryland. But before, you were living in Pittsburgh

00:35:02.640 - 00:35:17.440

because of your husband, so did your husband have to move to Maryland with you? Okay. He continued his Ph.D. research in Pittsburgh while I lived in Maryland. So, he had to drive four to five hours every week

00:35:18.170 - 00:35:33.300

, not on daily basis though, because we still have — somebody need to provide financial support to the family. And at that time, we had a newborn baby so I

00:35:33.300 - 00:35:49.720

took the job at NASA and then he just commute every week to see me and my son. Good thing that my pay at NASA was very nice, maybe 30% higher than my husband’s post-doctoral.

00:35:51.960 - 00:36:11.790

I didn’t work there long, only one year, because he got a job at Exxon. That’s a real industrial job and the pay was like more than double of that post-doctoral research job. So, I had to quit my job and then moved with him to

00:36:12.490 - 00:36:21.910

Baton Rouge, Louisiana. At that time, I was wondering where’s Baton Rouge? Actually, when you ask me what’s the huge difference?

00:36:22.040 - 00:36:37.740

Living in Baton Rouge, Louisiana is not like living in United States. You know what I mean? Because there at Baton Rouge, they are more French descent, more Cajun people.

00:36:38.690 - 00:36:51.940

And I already have challenge in English, right? They speak different English! And they don’t understand my English! And I think people

00:36:51.940 - 00:37:08.390

living in Louisiana, they all are like a close family there. They all want to live in Louisiana, they don’t want to move outside Louisiana. Even I was in Baton Rouge, that’s the capital of Louisiana, is a big tourist city,

00:37:09.490 - 00:37:22.620

but if there is a traffic stop on highways, everybody stops to look what happened because that might be their relatives, my friend’s relatives, because everybody know each other.

00:37:23.070 - 00:37:36.850

And because they live so close together, they don’t go outside. So, to me, I was like “the animal” in the room. Everywhere I go, people stared at me with thousands of eyes,

00:37:37.200 - 00:37:50.540

wondering what is that species, where she came from? You know? It’s not like unfriendly, but it’s—they don’t see people like me before, you know, in Louisiana.

00:37:52.530 - 00:38:11.270

And when I communicated with my technician or other people at job, it was challenge that they all got a Cajun accent and I got this Chinese accent. Sometimes, sometimes it becomes jokes.

00:38:12.650 - 00:38:24.350

So where else have you lived before coming to Houston? You said there was Oklahoma, there’s a brief stint at Salt Lake City, there’s Norman, Oklahoma , Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Baton Rouge.

00:38:25.000 - 00:38:37.300

And then Houston. So, Houston is my second home because I have lived here twenty years. I lived in Taiwan for 20 plus years, twenty-one, twenty-two years.

00:38:38.030 - 00:38:50.670

So, this is my second home. Uh, so this is the longest city in United States. But my husband and me, we visited, we managed to visit

00:38:50.670 - 00:39:02.160

maybe more than forty states in United States. We tried to take every break, vacation, go around the United States so that’s why I said this

00:39:02.160 - 00:39:18.800

is a big country. I still haven’t seen every part of the United States but we went to, you know, the major parts of the cities we like to see. Yeah. So you talked about your experience feeling like you were being kind

00:39:19.100 - 00:39:36.610

of looked at differently in Louisiana. Um, were there any other moments like any other places that you felt kind of different because you were Asian or were there in

00:39:39.900 - 00:39:51.000

contrast some cities that you felt like, “hey there’s also a lot of Asian people here,” or “maybe people aren’t looking at me differently.” Uh, the other cities were okay. Like in Salt Lake City, because those people they live there have

00:39:51.400 - 00:40:02.440

strong religions, they went to different parts of the world. I meant, they were very nice and friendly to us even when we spoke, you know, in broken English, but they understood us. And there were lots of very

00:40:02.710 - 00:40:19.630

nice senior ladies, they were really nice to us. In Norman, it’s more of a small town, but it’s a college town. There were lots of international students. So, I wasn’t looked at that way either.

00:40:20.110 - 00:40:37.860

Then, in NASA or Pittsburgh, it’s also a college town or college city, right. So, I didn’t feel like I was discriminated at all and at NASA, it was all scientists, so we all focus on

00:40:38.110 - 00:40:52.670

scientific research that kind. It’s less cultural impact. But moved to Louisiana, that was the time I felt I’m a foreigner, completely a foreigner , like I

00:40:52.670 - 00:41:05.740

don’t fit in at all. That —it took me a while to adjust even though by that time I already lived in United States for how long? I moved to Louisiana in 1990.

00:41:07.580 - 00:41:21.470

So, it was how many? Seven years already. Seven years. How did , how did you adjust? How did —was your husband kind of helpful in feeling

00:41:23.150 - 00:41:34.770

like you weren’t so alone? Not really, we both needed to learn to adjust. Yeah. And we all just tried to work hard and study

00:41:34.770 - 00:41:47.330

hard to support the family. Uh see, remember I worked at NASA, I got nice pay. When I moved to Louisiana, I got a 30-percent pay cut because I worked

00:41:48.160 - 00:42:04.320

at Louisiana State University and when I took the job, it was a research associate. And Louisiana living expense is not as high as, you know, in Maryland. And, plus, it’s a university

00:42:04.320 - 00:42:19.800

job, right. But, good thing is that since I worked on campus, I took advantage to study on my second Master’s degree - computer science. So, I worked full-time and I studied part-time

00:42:20.490 - 00:42:37.460

in the evening. And I had a little baby at home, so we didn’t really have much time to—for social life. Because you know, day and night I had different jobs and

00:42:38.170 - 00:42:54.450

I didn’t have much time to sleep, to be honest, because I didn’t have computer science for my undergraduate and my graduate study was in computer science. But at that time, computer science is like the biggest

00:42:54.490 - 00:43:03.530

job market, right. And then, thinking as I always need to move around with my husband’s job - at least, that’s the time I was thinking, because see,

00:43:03.560 - 00:43:17.920

I moved from here to Maryland, and to here. So, studying in computer science might give me a better job opportunity to move with him. So, but I was

00:43:17.980 - 00:43:31.810

put on conditional, probation admission because I never took any computer language other than Fortran language that I took in my college back in Taiwan.

00:43:33.140 - 00:43:49.200

And, so they said, you don’t have any computer language skills, and how can you study in computer science? Every single course requires you to learn at least two languages in order to be able to do the homework.

00:43:49.870 - 00:44:02.490

So, and I don’t have time to take a lot of computer language courses, I have to take a real computer course like database systems. So, I had to learn the computer languages at my own.

00:44:02.490 - 00:44:19.860

Like, I had to take AI, artificial intelligence, I had to learn LISP, Prolog, or whatever. So I had to study those on the side, besides taking the class, and then study the language so to be able to do homework and pass

00:44:19.860 - 00:44:36.340

exams. So they put me on conditional admission, but I managed to get straight A’s through the graduate study and got my degree. And we both tried to work hard.

00:44:36.940 - 00:44:51.880

When I worked daytime and nighttime study, my husband after work need to care for the baby right. And then, when I graduated, he went back to school for MBA program so he worked fulltime.

00:44:52.130 - 00:45:08.610

He didn’t take Executive for MBA, even they offered him - LSU offered him Executive MBA admission because he works at Exxon. And Exxon gives huge grant to college or LSU, but he wanted to really learn it, so

00:45:08.610 - 00:45:19.090

he took the hard way. Means he got to study like four years part-time. So, we took time to work and study second degree.

00:45:19.510 - 00:45:33.800

You know. We kind of take turns to study, so we didn’t have much time for social life other than work and study and family. Yeah, but it pays off.

00:45:34.200 - 00:45:48.720

I got a nice job after I finished my Master degree in computer science. I took an industrial job and I got double pay. That’s why he can go back to school to

00:45:48.720 - 00:46:05.180

study for his MBA. He didn’t really need it but he said, you know, just doing research all his life, he just wanna, you know, made a difference too. So what brought you to Houston after Baton Rouge?

00:46:05.480 - 00:46:17.300

Good question! It was for my son. Remember we lived in Louisiana. Louisiana has been like second to the bottom in education other than Mississippi, right?

00:46:17.820 - 00:46:29.730

Even my son was tested to be gifted & talent when he was three-years old. I took him to doctor and he got tested as gifted & talent.

00:46:29.980 - 00:46:43.830

So, he was able to take gifted & talent class for pre-school and kindergarten and all the way to elementary. But, Louisiana education environment is very poor.

00:46:45.260 - 00:46:59.650

So poor, I meant not just teacher resources. Even we were good because he was in a very small class, like seven students only. But, it’s a mixed school system, means if

00:46:59.650 - 00:47:12.850

they have gifted & talent program, they got to have students from other area, like very poor neighborhood. So, even you are most concentrated in your class, you don’t mix with other people.

00:47:13.400 - 00:47:29.400

Still, kids they observe and learn. So even the bathroom, they don’t even have a door, or some don’t have even tissue paper. So, so we were thinking, you know, after he finished the fifth grade we got to move.

00:47:30.200 - 00:47:49.880

So, we both decided we gotta move to a better education place. Houston is the closest one to Baton Rouge and it’s a big city, has a better education environment. So, we decided to you know, throw resumes and

00:47:50.030 - 00:48:06.030

see if we can find a job in Houston. And I was in computer science, so it was easy. I just applied for a few jobs and I got offers at Exxon, Shell Oil, Chevron, and

00:48:06.340 - 00:48:19.330

Deloitte consulting firm as well as Compaq – yeah, at that time there was a company called Compaq. I got several offers, but my husband he did not get any offers. Because he is with Ph.D.

00:48:19.460 - 00:48:36.770

degree, right. And the pay at Exxon was already pretty high and I guess, the Master degree in computer science I had the advantage. But, we couldn’t wait or we did not want to delay children’s education.

00:48:37.310 - 00:48:53.690

So, my husband convinced me to take my son and then move to Houston first, so he can get to the junior high in new school for the transition. Even though we were thinking about moving during his elementary school but,

00:48:54.240 - 00:49:07.380

as I said, he was in a very concentrated program. And he always studies one or two grades above his level, so he was doing good. But, we still wanted to

00:49:07.380 - 00:49:22.310

look for better education environment for him. So, I took my son to Houston. And my husband did not want me to work for his competitors like Chevron or Shell Oil. So, I

00:49:22.310 - 00:49:38.680

took the job at Exxon and, and we moved here. That was like twenty years from today, we moved here in August, 1999. So, and I started to look for housing so I can

00:49:38.880 - 00:49:51.500

put him in a school district that has a nice learning environment. And I worked at Exxon Chemical, which is in the Energy Corridor, Memorial, Eldridge.

00:49:51.990 - 00:50:11.920

I found a house in a subdivision called Lakes of Parkway online. It’s right behind you know just a few miles and it was very nice living environment. So, I told my husband we don’t need to do house-hunting, I’m just gonna live there.

00:50:12.100 - 00:50:27.550

And, it’s a gated environment, so it’s safe for me and my son to live there alone. But, after we went back to Baton Rouge, oh, he came with me for the, for the job interview, he studied and found out that , “oh no!”,

00:50:27.550 - 00:50:42.790

the public school district there isn’t very good, unless we want to go private school. And I said hmm, that’s a long way to go to finish the twelfth grade. And schools

00:50:43.360 - 00:51:01.170

here in Houston, tuition is much higher in private schools than the schools in Baton Rouge because everything is cheaper in, in, in Louisiana. So, we decided to look for same builder, but you know,

00:51:02.210 - 00:51:15.730

with better school district. That’s how I found a house in Katy, at that time, the builder - Kickerillo, just started to build housing in that community and that’s why we moved

00:51:16.180 - 00:51:29.150

there. So what high school did your son go to? He went to a new high school called “Cinco Ranch High”. That’s where I graduated! That’s where you graduated?! Really? You live in Katy?

00:51:29.150 - 00:51:47.140

Wow! So you are so close! Actually, he’s supposed to go to Taylor High from where we live. But I guess in our subdivision, somebody has influence to the superintendent or I don’t know what’s the impact,

00:51:48.250 - 00:52:05.630

so they divided by the subdivisions, made us go to the new high school - Cinco Ranch. So actually, Taylor High is much closer to us than go far to Cinco Ranch High. But that school was new, had good computer

00:52:05.630 - 00:52:16.450

facilities for learning environment, so we were pleased, yeah. So, we have lived in Katy ever since. What is your son’s name? Nicholas Wen.

00:52:16.740 - 00:52:28.850

And where did he end up in —like for college? Oh, he went to the business school in Austin, University of Texas in Austin. He went to the MPA

00:52:28.910 - 00:52:42.480

program, Master of Professional Accounting or Accountant. Must be Accounting, yeah. He took five-year program and so he got an MPA

00:52:42.760 - 00:52:58.670

degree. And he kind of goofed around. You know? Because remember, he was studying one or two grades above the levels? So, when he came here, and he took two grades above, like in math.

00:52:59.070 - 00:53:12.110

Then, one day he walked to the classroom, you know, all the others think, hey stupid kid! You walked into the wrong classroom. You know, boys grow slower than girls, right?

00:53:12.720 - 00:53:28.840

So, when he was in elementary he wasn’t very tall. Moved to a new city, a big city, then the first class he walked into the 8th grade math. People were thinking hey you are in the wrong classroom.

00:53:30.510 - 00:53:43.280

Anyway, he’s supposed to be able to finish high school in three years. but he didn’t want to go to college before all his friends. He made really good friends in high school. Even now they’re still good friends.

00:53:43.710 - 00:53:57.050

So, he waited to graduate at the same time with all his high school students. And when he went to the MPA program, he’s supposed to be able to finish that program in four years because, I think, at the

00:53:57.050 - 00:54:08.830

third year, he got internship at a big four accounting firm. Immediately after internship, they already give you an offer, even you not graduated.

00:54:09.420 - 00:54:28.660

So he already had a job offer. So on the last year, he didn’t want to graduate earlier either! He wanted to graduate, as always, with his friends so he went fishing. But, it’s okay. But you’ve also been involved with

00:54:28.800 - 00:54:42.000

business as a consultant. So when did that happen between you working at Exxon to consulting? Right, remember I came here earlier and I tried

00:54:42.610 - 00:54:57.090

to help my husband get a chance to work at Exxon in Houston. Because he works at Exxon refinery in Baton Rouge, that’s downstream. He was doing R&D.

00:54:57.700 - 00:55:12.710

But here, the downstream is in Baytown, which is not a good living environment or education environment. So, we tried to get to different area. And Exxon is so big, but it’s not very easy to get in.

00:55:12.710 - 00:55:28.800

He was lucky enough, I guess it’s because I work for Exxon too. You know that might be the reason he was able to transfer here. But after he got transferred to Houston, we both work at Exxon and we all have nice

00:55:28.800 - 00:55:42.480

pay, the same benefits like we have gasoline cards for Exxon gas stations. You get 10% off. Even one person works at Exxon, the entire family all gets

00:55:43.080 - 00:55:54.180

gasoline discount cards. And you know, he has medical, I have medical, we don’t have to have two medicals. A lot of benefits are duplicates.

00:55:54.750 - 00:56:08.820

So, I was thinking, hey, I came here at the time Exxon just acquired Mobil, like two big oil companies merged together, and

00:56:08.820 - 00:56:25.200

one is using Apple, another is using Windows. You know, for example, like apple and orange, complete, completely different systems. You know from desktop, email system, all the way to

00:56:25.250 - 00:56:40.850

enterprise, totally different. So we had huge integration work to do. And I was put in the SAP system implementation project for the global, not only in North America but you know

00:56:40.850 - 00:56:55.000

Middle East, Europe, and Asia Pacific and Africa. I was put in the SAP program, part of the reason is, I had an industrial job in Louisiana. My company got

00:56:55.000 - 00:57:10.370

acquired by another company and they did global implementation during that time using the SAP applications simply and because they have so many subsidiaries and all in different industries.

00:57:12.200 - 00:57:25.920

So, they have to use same kind of enterprises system. And I earned the experience there, that might be part of the reasons why Exxon hired me. Because at that time ExxonMobil, or at that time was Exxon only,

00:57:26.070 - 00:57:36.350

and then Shell oil and Chevron they all tried to get into the Enterprises System. So soon after I was hired, I was put into that program.

00:57:36.800 - 00:57:53.000

At that time, SAP consulting pay is double than employee’s pay. You know, I said, hey we both work at the same company, you know we really did not have double benefits.

00:57:53.340 - 00:58:06.270

So, after I finished that SAP global project, it was like five years program, and after I finish that, I quit and formed my own consulting firm.

00:58:06.950 - 00:58:26.590

I started to work for BP and other oil companies as a contractor, or as a project manager, or architect, mainly on the enterprise architecture or data architecture. So that’s the time I quit and then

00:58:26.740 - 00:58:35.860

run my own business. I thought, you know, I only need to work less than 6 months to get the same pay. Yeah. And that’s iWen International.

00:58:36.220 - 00:58:46.970

Yeah! That’s iWen International. But, that job requires me to travel a lot because depends on where the client is.

00:58:47.390 - 00:59:05.090

So one year, I had to go to Baton Rouge! Actually, New Orleans in Louisiana, you know because Shell Oil has a big presence in Louisiana right in New Orleans.

00:59:05.880 - 00:59:20.290

So I had to commute there every week, like you know, come home on Friday afternoon and leave on Sunday afternoon, on weekly basis because I was doing consulting job.

00:59:22.430 - 00:59:41.870

Yeah. Did you face any serious barriers throughout your career? Throughout career? Uh…at ExxonMobil doing the global system implementation, that was my —

00:59:42.540 - 01:00:02.680

the challenging part in my career development. Because it was such a diversified work environment, people from Europe they think their system is the best and they know better about the application or the

01:00:02.680 - 01:00:15.890

system than anyone, any Americans, or any Americans in United States. Remember, it’s a global project? And everybody wants to use their system, you know.

01:00:16.510 - 01:00:32.450

And so, people in Singapore, they think they have the SAP 4.0, that’s the newest, greatest system, we should use their system. Europe they have the SAP 2.0 system, that’s like a dinosaur, right?

01:00:32.670 - 01:00:47.450

And then, some parts of Exxon chemical they have the SAP 3.0 system. As I was project manager, that means, everyday from 8 to 5, I was running meetings, meeting, meeting, and meeting to get everybody’s buy-in.

01:00:49.160 - 01:01:02.480

That was really difficult. Prior to that, you know, I’m very strong on my left brain, I’m never strong on my right brain. Dealing with people, tried to get

01:01:02.480 - 01:01:18.890

everybody’s buy-in on one decision that was like meeting after meeting, after meeting, after meeting. And then, another issue was that even we’re supposed to work from 8 to 5, but talk to Europe you got to do

01:01:19.200 - 01:01:39.550

early morning meetings, talk to Asia Pacific, you got to work at 9pm. So, that —dealing with different people really tough, particularly European, to my opinion. Do you think being a woman and a minority, do

01:01:40.440 - 01:01:52.440

you think that put any significant barriers in your way during your career? Yes, that was also during SAP implementation. I never thought, hey I’m a woman and minority,

01:01:53.500 - 01:02:10.090

but in that project somehow I felt like I was very discriminated, you know. Because I’m a woman and I’m foreigner, it’s like, you know, they don’t hear what I said or what I said made no

01:02:10.140 - 01:02:23.930

difference. But, I had to get everybody to buy in so we can move forward. Without a decision, without consensus on every part, you cannot move forward.

01:02:24.100 - 01:02:40.650

We cannot drag the project too long, because there’s a limited budget. And yeah, I mean even in ExxonMobil, such a big company, they always say, you know, diversify, right?

01:02:41.280 - 01:02:55.140

Um, but not, not when I worked in the SAP global implementation. Other than that, I never thought I’m a “female” employee.

01:02:55.950 - 01:03:14.280

Yeah. So, you’ve talked a little bit about the challenging parts of your career. What are some parts that you really enjoyed? Um, I guess that was the time, the first industrial job after my Master

01:03:14.280 - 01:03:27.330

degree in computer science. I was the only with degree, computer sciene degree worked at a company’s IT department. I was given

01:03:27.360 - 01:03:45.400

opportunities to do everything and anything, you know? Because they think, wow, I’m the guru , you know. Even I was hired as a system administrator, but I was given opportunities and power to do

01:03:45.810 - 01:03:59.020

everything I want to do. So, I went from system administrator to, doing the database management, doing application programming, and doing even the network

01:03:59.430 - 01:04:14.050

system - local area network, wide area network, you know I didn’t really have that much background in networking at all. Everything is on the job learning, I, I even needed to take screwdrivers, fix PC,

01:04:14.050 - 01:04:29.650

how in the world! I know what’s the cross and flat, but they all think I have the computer science degreeI’m the master, so for desktop hardware, software application and integration - you know, desktop with

01:04:29.690 - 01:04:42.420

the, the enterprising system integration, you know. I will say, hey can you do that! So, I learned a lot, a lot, a lot, and a lot and that was the part I really enjoyed.

01:04:42.470 - 01:04:58.780

I think I got most experience on that job. I grew myself really well. That’s why I guess my resume looks really nice. Because I had experience from

01:04:58.780 - 01:05:10.090

ground up. And. I didn’t go to the management right away. I went from systems administrator and after three years, you know, they see how I performed.

01:05:11.670 - 01:05:28.410

Then, I was promoted to become the IT manager. And later, upon company acquisition, I was doing a lot of systems networking and integration, and then SAP system implementation.

01:05:28.410 - 01:05:43.540

So, I learned a lot right after my master’s degree. That’s the growing period of my career. Working at Exxon, really nice pay and learned a lot, but mainly on the soft side.

01:05:43.540 - 01:05:58.960

That means, dealing with human relations, and that’s never my interest. Because I like to learn and I like challenge, but don’t want to deal with so many people issues.

01:06:00.220 - 01:06:15.090

But working in global system implementation, because everybody, when I say everybody, you know Exxon has chemical, has downstream, and upstream, and Europe have different company systems.

01:06:15.090 - 01:06:28.210

Just agree on “the company codes”, which is part of the system configuration, it took forever. You know, that part I didn’t enjoy that much. Simply because it has way

01:06:28.210 - 01:06:43.640

too many issues, trying to marry apple with orange together. It’s like men’s and women’s world try to fight. Uh you are

01:06:44.580 - 01:06:54.300

currently a member of several community organizations? Can you describe what you do in those roles? Okay, I got into the community services.

01:06:54.410 - 01:07:07.340

It’s when my high school - Taipei First Girls High, when it celebrates 100-years old birthday. And that’s the first time I went to the Chinese community. Prior to that,

01:07:07.470 - 01:07:22.270

you know, I focused a lot on work. And you know, the work life is already very busy, really didn’t have much social life. I didn’t do much of the community service other than science ambassador –

01:07:22.780 - 01:07:36.440

and that’s with ExxonMobil program. I volunteered to be a science ambassador so we can give grant to school and then help them on the science and math programs.

01:07:38.530 - 01:07:52.470

But, that still came out with the company, right, and that didn’t take too much of my time outside the work. When my high school celebrated her 100-year anniversary, I realized, wow, there are so many Chinese in Houston!

01:07:53.830 - 01:08:12.680

And, and, and so they started to encourage me to go to different social activities and events hosted and organized by my high school. Later on, they asked me to the board and became one of the board

01:08:12.750 - 01:08:29.310

members. Soon, I became the vice president and the president of the alumni association. During my presidency of my high school girls high , I made a few milestones for my alumni association, like

01:08:29.310 - 01:08:48.020

established the honor guard and the color guard team. You know, Taipei First Girls High’s marching band, honor guard and color guard, is world famous. They, they performed worldwide for many years.

01:08:49.400 - 01:09:09.600

This year is the 55th years’ anniversary of the team. And, I, I established the team in Houston because we have lots of activities, international festivals, or national day all

01:09:10.170 - 01:09:27.620

requires some kind of carnival team or honor guard for opening ceremonies. And because we celebrate national day every year, and since Taipei First Girls High’ honor guard team is world famous, and I was the president ,

01:09:28.170 - 01:09:41.970

they asked - hey why don’t you form a team? I asked one of the former presidents about it, They said - you think that’s easy? If it’s that easy, it won’t wait that long until you are the president to do

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that. But remember I’m the one, I’m not afraid of challenge. You know, I come to United States alone without knowing anybody, right? I have no families, no relatives, no friends other than the college’s senior in Salt

01:09:57.990 - 01:10:13.880

Lake City. So I was brave enough to accept the challenge to come to United States, so I’m not afraid of challenge. I formed that team. And so after I established the team for the community,

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a lot of international events’ formal opening ceremonies including the Independence Day, July 4th you know like care opening ceremony, they all asked us to do.

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So, I became the “celebrity” of the Chinese community. So, other organizations invited me to join their organizations. That’s how I started to get into the community services. It’s all started with the Taipei First Girls

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High Alumni Association. And because that’s the best high school everybody is aware, right. Remember we got to take entrance exam even going to the high

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school? So people already respect you because they know you competed at the national level and you are one of the best students. So whatever you do, they have high confidence on you.

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And I always have good confidence on myself already. So, from all the communities service demonstrations, started to have more

01:11:35.190 - 01:11:50.950

organizations invite me to join their boards. And that’s why I became the treasurer of Global Federation of Chinese Business Women , and later on the vice president and the president and now the board advisor.

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And. also, for the Federation of Chinese Traders Alumni Association, yeah, I was a board member, then vice president, now I’m the president. And this year, there are 55—57 civil organizations elected me to be the chair

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for the Houston Double Ten National Day Celebration Committee. National Day is a huge event, you know, the biggest event in Houston, right, for overseas Chinese community’s concern

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and from Taipei Economic and Cultural Offices’ perspective. Because—even I said the biggest event, it’s not one event. Prior to me, I don’t know

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how many, maybe 10 or twenties, but this year, I have thirty events, just for the National Day Celebration. And the events, you know, has varieties. Golf tournaments, tennis tournaments, culture performance at

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the Stafford Center, all the arts & exhibitions, all kinds, oil paintings, photography exhibition, or even ceramic arts, you know, different culture events, it’s very variety, and I really enjoy this kind of

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community services because I love people and I enjoy being loved too. And when you contribute, people love you and I feel, you know , feel rewarded, you know. That’s, to me, that’s better than

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financial incentive. So, I started to devote more and more so now I’m, I’m almost not working for my own company.

01:13:45.600 - 01:13:58.180

You know, remember I was doing consulting work and depends on you want to accept the project or not, yeah. So if it’s a project you like, you take it. If you don’t like, you don’t take.

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So now, I devote more time to community services. And then, I’m a family-oriented person, remember, you ask me what’s the challenge to me, just say “me, me, me,” it took me maybe more than twenty years

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to learn that. So now, back in the community, that has more Chinese than Taiwanese people, they came from the same background and culture like me. I feel like I have a bigger family because my family is still

01:14:30.410 - 01:14:45.730

in Taiwan, right? I’m still the only one in United States other than my own family, my husband and my son. So now, I feel like I have a bigger family, I have lots of good sisterhood and friends, and then,

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so they kind of enlarge my social life, my social network, so I kind of enjoy that part. Before that, I worked for my family. Now, I can work for the community you know without pay.

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How would you describe the Asian American community in Houston? The one that you’ve gotten so involved in. I really enjoy. I think they make a huge difference.

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Living in United States, like for example, Chinatown, people are from other places, but we contribute to that society, or to the community I should say. See, we spend a lot of our earnings in there, and that

01:15:34.520 - 01:15:51.190

helps the business in Chinatown, and then they feedback to other parts of businesses in some Asian communities. I think, for most of Asian people, we

01:15:51.280 - 01:16:09.160

help Asian people a lot, that’s why we donate here and there and there. It’s not like I’m a millionaire, but you know, if I have many dollars, I can have a steak. But if I don’t, I have beef noodles, I also enjoy

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it a lot. I don’t have to eat steak everyday, I can have beef noodles somedays, which only cost 6,7 dollars, right, versus 70 dollars. So, we like to contribute, you know, not only time

01:16:24.530 - 01:16:34.970

and financial wise, all the support I can give. I think I speak for most of the Asian here, am I right? So, and that’s why the Asian

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community grow you know in prosperity, because we all have the same kind of thinking, we like you know our family, and not only my own family, my big family, my bigger family, and my biggest

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community, and whenever you need it, like remember, when I got my first job ? People help each other without knowing your credit, right? Back then, there’s no credit score or loan you can get

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easily from bank, right? So, you know, you borrow money from me, I borrow money from them, and we return whenever we could hopefully on monthly basis. People live by their trust, one day you will return

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to me. It might delay one month or three months, but you know, we help each other because you know the money gather law. Sometimes you can afford it and at that time I might not be able to afford it.

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I think that’s what is growing in the Asian community. We always help each other and then pass on to generations. And, that’s what I’m very proud of the community services, you know.

01:17:57.810 - 01:18:08.850

Yeah, because we help each other. Today I help you, one day, you don’t return to me but you might return to my kids, my grandkids, you never know.

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Because we’re not doing that for favor, but just pass on to generations. And hopefully our generations can have a better living environment and they can have a better life than us.

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We always ask for better and better and better. Yeah, you answered a lot of the questions that— Yeah, talking about the future. Um something I want to know is, do you identify as an

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Asian American or a Taiwanese American or like completely American. What does that mean to you? What does your identity mean to you? I think I’m, I’m most of the time, identify myself as Asian American.

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And then, before China opened the door, we always say we are Chinese. But when China opened the door, they say they are the Chinese and even when we are all Chinese, you know like other

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parts of Chinese descent in Asia, Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand, or other parts of Asia, they are Chinese descent, but being closed for almost fifty years in China, we really

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have a different culture and different philosophies, different life standards, really very different. And, that’s why we started to differentiate - we are Taiwanese because

01:19:39.750 - 01:19:53.130

people from Taiwan, we are more loving and caring, relatively speaking, okay? It’s not everybody from China, they are all alike, or they are like everybody from Taiwan.

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But, relatively speaking, for majority part you know, we try to differentiate we are Taiwanese, you know, sometimes it’s because of political issues, which you know I try to stay away.

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From cultural perspective, we really have different thinking, mindset and philosophy. You know, we have different moral standards, and that’s why we started to

01:20:23.230 - 01:20:36.590

differentiate - hey we are Taiwanese. Hey we are Taiwanese, we are Taiwanese. Because Taiwanese, Chinese people we came to United States much earlier, at least

01:20:36.680 - 01:20:48.450

50 years earlier than people from mainland of China. And most of the Asian American established in United States, they are all from

01:20:48.480 - 01:21:08.420

Taiwan, a majority of them are from Taiwan. But, because we’re all called Chinese, right. Yeah, you know what I meant? So, when we talk - the way

01:21:08.540 - 01:21:24.390

we do, the people from mainland will say – oh, you are from Taiwan. Like sometimes, when we open our mouth, they already know you are Taiwanese, because only Taiwan people would do things like that. They think it is stupid, but you know, we don’t think it is stupid.

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If the more we give, you know, the better community gonna be. I don’t, I don’t have to do everything just for myself, yeah. Remember that? That’s the big part of difference

01:21:41.660 - 01:21:55.010

between US and Taiwan. In United States, it’s more individual basis - people focus on me, me, me, and we are

01:21:55.010 - 01:22:09.470

always thinking of bigger family. So, it took me awhile to learn – hey, I can do something for myself and I don’t have to feel guilty, you know. And that impacts

01:22:10.710 - 01:22:19.380

my generation, unlike my son. He doesn’t have that because he was born here. He grew up here, so he thinks it’s less natural thing to do, right?

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But, to us, it’s a, it’s a big shift from my thinking - hey, I can have a spa and don’t need to feel guilty, I didn’t go home to cook for family, you know. Because we kind of used

01:22:37.980 - 01:22:54.220

to giving, we used to giving and that’s how the Asian community grew very well. Yeah, I really enjoy it and yes, I want to be part of it and continue to

01:22:56.070 - 01:23:10.260

contribute as much as I can, yeah. Um, I have one more question. Yeah, I think we’re just out of time. Yeah okay, what advice would you give you a to future generation of

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immigrants or Asian Americans? I think love, you know, give more love to people. If we show you love, people, how can they hate you, right?

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If you love them, you know one day or later, they gonna come back to love you because they see the power of it. If you empower people, you love them, you support and empower

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them, they will become a better one. One day, they gonna come back and then to help other people whom they can help, not necessarily you, but we wanna pass on to

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generations so I wanna give the message to my son. Back then, he has been doing sort of community services because I encouraged him to go internationally when

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he was in high school for first year. After first year, he took Spanish language and then he went to Honduras for two months. Honduras is a country without, you know, drinking water,

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you know you cannot drink from tap water, you have to run through the filter. And there’s no power after sunset. So, but so, he went there to help people build water well or school or else.

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He learned a lot because he saw his host family has only two rooms and they have four kids. It’s just summer, two months

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you know, he stayed there at a very good host family already, but they have only two bedrooms and they gave one bedroom to my son and the other volunteer. And they all squeezed together in one room.

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I meant, work there is very hardworking, because um, all the sanitizing things are not very well. So, the other boy, they only have two students for one

01:25:22.650 - 01:25:40.660

town, that student got sick and was in hospital for a while and then sent back to United States. So he was the only one who did the township work, but it was worthy, because he came back—before

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he came back, after two-month community services, they killed two chickens to feed all the people the entire town people including the volunteer from surrounding towns. Only two chickens, and, he didn’t want to

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take any bites of those chickens because his host family has 4 kids. I asked him what do you eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner? He said, mommy, it’s corn, tortilla, and bean. I said how about lunch?

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Bean, tortilla, and rice. How about dinner? Rice, bean, and tortilla. Isn’t it the same thing? He said, yes, he was really

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sick of those food. So, for the first month after the community services, they had mid-meeting at the hotel. And there’s a nearby Chinese restaurant, he went there to get fried rice and then

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he ate that fried rice, in the Chinese to-go, for three days. I said you don’t have refrigerator, how can you eat that rice for three days? He said mommy , it’s better than eating those rice, bean, and

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tortilla every day! So, when he came back, I asked – hey, what do you want? What do you want to eat, when we picked him up at the airport. He said, mommy, I want the cashew chicken.

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I went to Café Taipei to order cashew chicken, when I came back, he said, this is all for me? And that’s why he told me for the two months, he only had that two-chicken to eat, you know, at the end of the

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community services, but he didn’t take any. He said, this chicken dish is all for me? And then he, he came back to our house and went upstairs, asked this is my room? This room is bigger than my host family’s.

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Then, he started to value things, you know, really what was given to him, you know, and won’t take everything for granted. Starting that, I think that

01:27:49.520 - 01:28:09.400

community service really turns him from a boy into a man. Yeah. I really —even I was heartbroken sending him to that poor town without anything, also he came back with a lot of funky stuff in his feet, you know,

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because they didn’t have good shoes or the shoes was broken, worn out after hardwork. Anyways, it was hard work for him, but he learned a lot.

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And after that, I didn’t need to worry about him anymore. And then, he grew his manhood and he started to have a lot of good friends because he learned to give and to love.

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So even now, you know, he still has all of his best friends from high school while he has college friends as well. I think, he learned a lot from that community services.

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So—even though they are very poor, they used the cotton strings to make some kind of necklace, bracelet and to make purse, you know, a little purse as gifts to him.

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He still has those today, even though you cannot really use that for anything, but he wore it through–throughout his high school. He has that colorful string, you know, it’s just a cotton string, it has

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red and green colors. And that necklace, because it’s made by the host family’s children – and so he hugged them and cried before he

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left. Yeah, I think, so I think community services overall is really good. It’s, you know, not only for us — we contribute at different level and different things.

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So, I asked my son - say, never quit your community services. You know, you contribute on different part to the community. And that make the whole

01:30:04.240 - 01:30:15.250

community really loving, you know, and good. Alright, I think— That’s it from us. Thank you for sharing. Oh, thank you very much!