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Interviewee: NARGESH SETHNA Interviewers: SHIREEN USMAN ; ALISHA ZOU This is Alisha Zou. And, Shireen Usman. We are here today on July 9th, 2013, in Nargesh

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Sethna’s home, um on—to interview Nargesh Sethna for the Houston Asian American Archive Oral History Interview Project. Okay. Um, could we begin by you telling us a little bit about yourself?

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About myself? Yeah, anything. I’m an old lady now . 85 years old. And, just housewife

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now—retired—I had a job. I mean I always worked after my high school. Up ‘till—up ‘till 1999. And, then I retired, and I’m

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at home, and do some other work—like homework, housework and all that. What else do you want me—to know about me? Where you were born, where—

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I was born in Bombay, India, and I got married and my husband came from Karachi, Pakistan, so I went there—to Karachi, for eleven years. And, then we came here, moved here, to

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Houston. My brother came to Rice University on a scholarship. In those days you can only go to Rice University on scholarship. So, he came on scholarship from Bombay, and he was given a

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scholarship in Bombay. So, he came to Rice. So, we all came to Rice—I mean we all came to Houston because he was here in Houston.

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And, then after that his daughter also was a Rice student, and uh I don’t know now—I mean, so that’s how we came to Houston. And, as soon I came to Houston, I started working here too.

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I went for an interview—I didn’t give any exams or anything. Can she join you? Sure. She’s making her own notes about her. She’s a good friend of ours.

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She you know—when we came to Houston—her husband and she—they came here, helped us out—you know making our house like this. Actually, this trunk was polished and cleaned by her .

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And, it’s still going because she—it’s not spoiled yet. So, how old were you when you moved with your family to Houston?

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Must be about in 40s somewhere. I moved here in ’71 and I’m born in ’28, so 71 minus 20—uh 28—not

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78—99 and 28. So, I think it was ’71 or something. And, so were you already married when you came here? Right, I was already married.

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I was married and I had a son—I have a son still. Because uh we’re really curious about your childhood and what kind of neighborhood you grew up in, and your family dynamics. Actually, you know we all—we are known as Parsis in India, Bombay.

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And uh we always live in our own society like you know—they called baghs—baghs means gardens you know. So we live in a Parsi colony and went to Parsi sch—girl’s high school.

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And only girls were educated up to the metrics—we had metric system in those days—British rule was there. So, we had a metric system and I—I passed matriculation

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exam and that comes—the paper comes from London—used to come from London, and then we had an exam all over India, at—on the same day. You see it’s not like school exam—at every

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school has a different exam and different paper—no. You may be in Bombay, and you get the same paper as you are in Calcutta. So, that’s

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how it was, you know. And then you know after finishing that school I got a chance to work as a—on a nominal payment somewhere in writing ration cards.

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Because um in those days there was rationing in Bombay. So, to write ration cards—that’s so many people in Bombay—I don’t think you have see Bombay. Have you?

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No, no—it’s so crowded, and there’s so many people that you know writing ration card was a big job. We had those army barracks in Bombay because the war had just finished—Second World War.

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And, the barracks were empty, so they recruited girls or ladies to write ration card, and we were all put in barracks to write ration cards. And, if you

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write—we were given a quota of seventy cards. We have to write seventy cards, and after you finish seventy cards you can leave. You can go home, or you can go anywhere you like.

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But, we used to write seventy cards and then keep then extra cards, and on Friday’s we used to give the seventy cards, what we had collected and then we go home early at eleven o’clock or ten

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o’clock . So, you know one day there was a raid on us—and he says, ‘You Parsis, you are too much. How can you finish seventy cards in one hour time?’ You know, when it takes

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one hour to write it. But, we did—we had our extra savings of cards, and then we enjoyed it. I really enjoyed that um job very much than any other job because we made good friends.

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Because I never went out from colony—from Parsi colony. It was just everything in colony, only the Parsis, but we got nice colonies in Bombay—Parsi colonies. Good, clean, and you know all

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Parsis—it’s good. But, still you know, there was no outside exposure for us. What else? So, did you ever interact with anyone outside of the colony or was it never?

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Never. Not ‘till I started working. And, so your ration—writing the ration cards job was outside of the colony. Yes. It was outside of the colony—nothing

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in colony you know. In colony there was only girl’s school and a boy’s school, but boy’s school was only for uh lower classes—standards. Girl’s school was up to matriculation, and if you passed metric, it was really a

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good—I mean they that in those days. It’s like getting a degree in BA or something. And, so what were your parent’s jobs when you were living there?

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My father was an accountant. And, you know there’s a big firm called Tata’s in—have you ever heard of Tata’s? No? And, he was an accountant for Tata Mills.

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And, my mother was a housewife. Women didn’t work in those days, so she didn’t go for work or anything. And she didn’t even had a school education because they won’t send the

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women to school. They just have to go to home thing. They used to get a teacher at home who taught them at home. But, she was good in her—whatever she learned with the teacher.

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You know she helped us out too, you know we were in school and she would help us out with maths and science and all that. What else do you want to know? So, were your family also Zo-Zoro-Zoroastrian,

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Zoroastrian? They are all Zoroastrian. All Parsis are Zoroastrians. All Zoroastrians are not Parsis. There are Zoroastrians in Iran, there are Zoroastrians in Russia, there are Zoroastrians all over the

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world in small groups. There are—but they are all not Parsis. Parsis are only in Bombay. They gave us a name—Indians gave us a name, Parsis,

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because we came from a place called Paras from Iran. In Iran there is a place called Paras. So, have you ever heard about it? No? Have you

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been to Iran? No. Never? Have you been there? No, I haven’t been there. But, all my sister or—Pearline has been—

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No, I haven’t. She hasn’t gone either. But, otherwise so many Parsis from here go to Iran, just for a visit and see what all things we had when we there because there are

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Zoroastrians in Iran too. That you know right—that there are Zoroastrians in Iran? We have Zoroastrian Iranis here too. Have you ever met them?

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No. How big is the community here? It’s quite big, but you know we have a language problem with them. We speak English and Indian languages. They speak Persian

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and French at the most—they don’t know Indian languages at all, and they don’t know English also—not very much. But, nowadays they—they do speak English because their children go to American school and they, they can speak with

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them. So, um how many siblings did you have? We have total brothers and sisters—six—two brothers and four sisters. They are all in

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Houston, except one in Bombay. All the other five are in—we are here. And, what are there names? And, one of the sisters is living here.

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And, so what are there professions? My profession? Uh, your siblings? Siblings? My second sister, she was a commercial artist. For air—working for Air India in

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Bombay, and um so she was an artist. And, this third sister which you met here she was a doctor—physical medicine doctor. Then my brother who came to Rice University, he is an

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engineer from Bombay and Rice. Then another sister who is a therapist, you know—what do you call—what therapist she is? Physical Therapist? Not,

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Physiotherapist. Um, okay the word will come to me, and I’ll tell you. Okay, she’s a therapist, and the last brother was a—is a nuclear scientist.

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So, that’s how we are. And, all of your brothers and sisters are still um Zo-Zoroastrian? They’re all Zoroastrians, right. And, are their children?

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Zoroastrians. We don’t convert. Zoroastrians don’t convert people to Zoroastrianism. You have to be born in that family to be a Zoroastrian. Um, could

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you tell us a little more about how um Zoroastrianism like how it um shapes your life? How is affects your life?

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Shapes our life? You know, Zoroastrianism—I mean teaches us to be three principles that we have. Zoro—we call them in our language is Humata, Hukhta, Hvarshta.

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Good de—uh good thoughts which will lead you to good uh good words and which will lead you to good deeds. So, if the—if you keep that—good thoughts—then you will never do anything

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wrong. You will do good deeds. And, if you do good deeds then you will not do any wrongdoing like good words—what is Katie doing there outside ? I’ll just

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come—excuse me for a minute . What else you want to know? So, when you moved to Houston did your parents move with you, or? No, parents—my parents didn’t move.

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My mother-in-law moved with me. She came with me from Kar—because she was alone. My father-in-law had died so she was alone and she was living with me. So, when we moved here she wanted to

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come with us so it was fine. And, so how did you meet your husband? Oh, he was in Bombay sometime back, and somebody introduce us and that’s how we met. And, then you know he

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wanted to get married with—to me . So, was it an arranged through the families, or did you meet him yourself? I—what, what? Was your marriage arranged though your families, or? Right, right. Of course, arranged.

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Could you also tell us about your children? I have one son, only one son. His name is Darayus. Okay, Darayus is a Persian name too.

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You know that or no? No… You haven’t read any Persian history at all? I’m not Persian myself; I just have a Persian name. Your mother is a Persian?

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No? No. Not even dad? No. So, why they’ve given you a Persian name? Um, I think because, well, my grandmother’s best friend was named that, so

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they named me that. And, you’re not Persian either? I’m Chinese. You’re Chinese? Mmhmm. But, your name sounds like a Persian name too.

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Really? Alisha? Alisha. I have a Chinese neighbor staying in front of me. But, she’s just gone to China right now. Because children.

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So, she’s gone to China. Um, have you ever gone back to India to visit? Oh yes. Many a times! Many times. What do you do usually? What do I do?

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Yeah, when you go visit? Meet friends, and you know relatives. And, um of course, and you know have good—have a good time—eat and go out and all that.

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That’s it! Um, which community do you prefer? Do you prefer the American community or the Indian, Parsi community? Oh—I prefer Zoroastrian community of course.

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I like uh to be in a Zoroastrian circle. And, we have a Zoroastrian Association here in Houston, and we meet very often. I mean we have so many—what do you call it—so many programs

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and you know and they are quite enjoyable. We have dinner parties and religious parities and all that. Come back to me later, and I’ll tell you more about her. Ok. You can tell her now.

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Well, I just wanted to—we wouldn’t have one without her. Because she was the founder I think—gathered everyone up. Right—she says I found all of them here—this, um, Parsi community.

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But, when I—we came here we were the only Parsis from Kar—Pakistan. Then you know whoever came to visit America, they would get my name from there—that I am there

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and I might help you. So, they’ll call me, they come here, they talk to me, they stayed in my house—many, now, like Rustomji you met now. But, Aban and her husband—somebody’s gave the

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name—my name to them, and her husband called me and says can we—can I come and stay for few days with you, till I find a job, and I said okay and like that many of them stayed back and um you know they got the

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jobs and they started working, and then they made their own homes and they go back and bring the family and all that. And, then of course Parsis who were here like Pearline and all that—they

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helped us out too you know. But, she was the one that organized dinners, I mean organized dinners for hundreds of people and stuff to get the community together and stuff like that, so she was very much a

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founder of the association and making sure the community gathered and, and knew each other and stuff. So, she’s not just a member of the community. Right. I, I used to keep accounts for the—this, our association.

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We built a center like here you know. We got a donation of the land and we, we built the building on it with other donation and um so we—I used to keep all the accounts for that—what we got

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and from whom we got. I still have that—I think Pearline you have to tell in the EC meeting that we should take all the books from me.

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So, when did you um start like forming this um organ—center after you moved here? Center? This was—we, we opened our center in ’78, right?

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No it was later than that, but the associ—no, it was after that, that the center opened—but the uh association started in the uh mid 70’s. And,

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so how did you find all the Zoroastrians in the community? Oh, they are all good. Like did you—how did you communicate with them, gather them all together? Uh, communicate with them?

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By telephone, or by just telling them, or letter or something, or by word of mouth you know. Because it wasn’t a big association in those days. We were few families. And we are always you know—we

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are alone, at the same time we are together, like you know. Have something to eat—come on, have a plate? No, we should—we’ll eat afterwards .

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Yeah, we can eat afterwards. Oh, okay you just eat first. They want to finish this and then they can relax and eat. Oh, okay. So, what was your first impression of Houston when you came from India? Oh, I like Houston because it has the same sort of climate

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like Bombay and Karachi and, so I like Houston. And, I made so many friends here—Parsi friends so you know I don’t feel that I’m out of India.

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What was the first Houston neighborhood that you moved into like? What? So, when you first moved to Houston, what was the neighborhood like, your neighbors? This is the neighborhood. I’ve—we just came here in ’71 and I—we bought this house

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in ’75 and from that time we are living here. And this is a good neighborhood, no crime, no— very few robberies and all that, and the schools are good. The high school is Bellaire High

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School; it’s supposed to be one of the good schools of Houston. Which school did you go to? She’s in Bombay . Her daughter is married here—not daughter, son is married here and she’s visiting her son, so she’s

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calling me to you know—because she has come from Bombay. And, so this is how Nargesh knows everyone. Yeah, right now she may have trouble

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remember a name or two, but she knows so many of them. When you first came to Houston did you work at all? I worked in Houston for thirty years. Thirty years? I had the same company,

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what I joined was—it’s a Japanese company I worked for a Japanese company called Toyomenka America Inc. How was that experience—did you like working there? Oh yes, because I used to do accounts for them, and

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I was the only one in the accounting department. So otherwise accounts was the—I had manage. And, they were good to me— Japanese people. Whenever they go back to Japan and come back

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they bring something—some present for us. You will see so many little, little things—you know it’s from Japan. How did you find that job? Through agency—employment agency.

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I—first they sent me to Gerber—you know Gerber—children’s food company—they sent me there because they wanted some temporary person in accounts.

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So they sent me there, and those people at Gerber told me that you know we’ll give you a questionnaire. And, then so they gave me a questionnaire—forty questions were there. And, they said in half an hour you have to finish this and that fellow told

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me, ‘Nobody finishes forty questions in half and hour, but you can try and we’ll see how many you can answer. And, don’t jump from one answer to the other answer—just go in a

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line.’ I said okay, and he left me in a big conference room and went away. I didn’t know what to do, but I answered all the questions—they were not very difficult questions, but you know I answered them.

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Then he came back after half an hour and he says, ‘Have you done something?’ I said yes I’ve written down some answers if you would like to see. He read them and he says, ‘Oh, you have done very well. Very good.’ I said okay now what do I do?

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So he says, ‘You’ll have to see the accountant because it’s a job in accounts.’ I said okay, so I said will he see me now? He says no come tomorrow. And, we were just moved in Houston also—so we

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didn’t have any transport or anything. We have to go by bus, and the buses here in this area were not frequent in those days. So, you know whatever it is, I said okay I’ll come tomorrow.

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Found out which bus goes at what time and then I went there. That accountant saw me after making me wait for half an hour, and he says, ‘Oh this is a temporary job. You won’t find a permanent job here because the

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woman who was working here is pregnant so she’s going on maternity leave, so you can—you have only three months to work.’ Or something like that. I said I don’t mind.

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I want some job. And, if I find another job, I’ll go. So he says, ‘Okay, but you’ll have to meet our personal manager.’ I said okay—for temporary jobs, fifteen people I have to see!

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And, but still I couldn’t say anything to him, and I said okay when do I see him. He says, ‘Can you come tomorrow?’ Again sends me next day. I said okay. Next day I went there, that personal manager took me, and

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he’s looking at everything and he says, ‘It seems you have done a very good job on your questionnaire, but can you do accounts in English?’ I said what that’s

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a silly question he’s asking me when you know I’ve answered those forty—not all forty questions—but you know so many question in uh English, and, ‘Can you do accounts in English?’ He thought I don’t know what is 1, 2, 3, 4.

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And, I said oh yes. Then he says you know—I said well I’ll try. I didn’t tell him that yes of course, but I said I’ll try, so he says, ‘Oh, okay.’ Then—then he says, ‘Do you know that this is only a temporary job?’ I

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said yes I know that, so then he says, ‘Okay we’ll discuss about you, and we’ll call you again.’ I said okay. Then when I left, I called that agency again and said, ‘these people are not interested in me. They

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—they asked me questions. She said, ‘don’t worry; I’ve got another job for you. You’ve got to go to this.’ She said, ‘Go right now.’ And that was this Japanese company. And from that day, I was working there till I retired.

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And they were very nice people. There at Gerber’s, I’d have to work half Saturdays, and the pay they offered me was $350. You know they1 offered me $450?

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And, no Saturday. And the working hours were nine to five. So I would work one hour less than the other people. It was very nice.

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And—they took care of me, like, you know, . One time I know that, uhm, it was raining so heavily, and I went by bus. So I was all drenched because I had to wait for the bus to come and I can’t take a shelter anywhere to go.

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And when I went to office, one Japanese actually brought out an umbrella for me. I felt so bad and he says, ‘Oh no no! It’s okay you can use this umbrella!

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It’s there with me, and I haven’t used it at all.’ It was a lady’s umbrella but he had not ever used it because he —I still have that umbrella. But they were so good to me like that! 1 Toyomenka America Inc.

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One of them taught me how to drive! One Japanese. On a company car. Big, huge company car. Chevrolet or something.

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And he taught me how to drive. And then one week he made me drive in every afternoon, lunch hour—one hour driving lessons. And then one day he says, ‘Monday

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we’ll give an exam—a driving test.’ I said, ‘I don’t know all these things! I’m so nervous— driving.’ He says, ‘No, why should you be nervous, you drive, ah, good!’ On Monday I gave the exams, I got my license, and my husband used to pick me up from work.

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So when he came, I said, ‘I’m driving home.’ He says, ‘You are driving home? No way!’ And uh, he was so scared that, you know, ah, then he says, ‘No, no, today’s not a good day to stand there and we’ll go on this day, that day.’ I say, ‘Okay.’ I

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say. He says, ‘You got your license?’ I said, ‘Yes. Of course I got my license!’ And then, then, you know after that, I started driving—that is only in the evening when we come home.

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Then I say, ‘I—I want to drive on the freeway.’ That was my ambition! To drive on the freeway! And he was so scared he says, ‘No, no way you are driving with me on the freeway!’

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And I said, ‘But I want to drive.’ And he says, ‘Okay! Okay we’ll see.’ When my brother—one brother-in-law was in Chicago, he came to visit his mother here. So I asked him, I

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said, ‘Can you take me on freeway? I can—I want to drive on freeway.’ He says, ‘Come on. Come.’ And we went on freeway, and he says, ‘You are fine! Just drive on freeway!

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Don’t listen to him.’ And that’s how I started driving. Then we went, all of us—with my brothers and sisters—we used to go on trips, road trips. And we would all drive in turns, because we were six of us.

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I mean, of course all them didn’t drive— my sister who’s in Bombay wouldn’t drive, so we the five of us used to drive. And we got all— husbands used to drive and so it was a good

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time, you know. I enjoyed it. That’s how we saw the America. That’s how we saw whole of America—by driving. And you know, because

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it’s cheaper, and we would divide between five of us—all the expense. And we had good fun in the car with children, and all that. We had a station wagon. My husband had a station wagon.

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So we would use the station wagon as a home; and then the backseat, we’d put the backseat up, but uh, some mat or something, and we make—the children would make it a kitchen! And then after the kitchen is over, everybody’s full, we make it a su—bedroom.

00:33:33.330 - 00:33:45.260

Everybody sleeps there! All the children and all them. And Katie was here, her husband used to be a driver most of the time. Mmm.

00:33:46.980 - 00:33:59.760

Where did it—so where did you go? Which places? Oh, we saw all—Colorado and on the way all the places. And then we went to Florida and we saw the whole of Florida.

00:34:00.450 - 00:34:12.270

We went right up to Toronto. Uhm, from Houston going Wa— Washington, D. C., and at time, there was a—I think it was Fourth of Ju—no,

00:34:12.410 - 00:34:26.000

Independence Day? No, Fourth of July or something. And Washington was so light up and so nice. We wanted to see that. Though we made it late there in Washington, but we saw all that fireworks and all that.

00:34:29.640 - 00:34:44.430

And then we went to Toronto, then we saw my brother’s wife’s brother or sister and brother—both lived in Toronto. So we end, uh, at their house.

00:34:44.710 - 00:35:03.230

So how did you learn about accounting and how did you become trained? No, I learned about accounting—is in Karachi. There, I gave full exams of London

00:35:04.340 - 00:35:16.890

Commerce—Chamber of Commerce Exams. That’s accounting and you know, we used to attend the classes; so I attended those classes and gave four exams, so that’s how I got a job

00:35:17.070 - 00:35:38.520

in—I had a job in Karachi, in Pakistan tobacco company. And uhm, so, I gave that exams, so I was uhm, given a raise of something. Then, you know, I came to Houston and I got this

00:35:38.820 - 00:35:55.870

Japanese company and it was fun. What do you think was the hardest part about moving to Houston? Uhm, it was, you know, anxiety. I wish—I’d say, I didn’t know what was going to happen

00:35:56.570 - 00:36:11.920

when I moved—that was the worst part, you know? When I moved from Bombay to Karachi, I knew what was going to happen—that I’m going there and I’ve got people there. Here, I’m coming with my mother-in-law, a small son, and

00:36:13.330 - 00:36:29.280

no jobs—both of us—and no place to live. Because all of them also, were had just a beginner’s job. You know, all my brothers and sisters. So that was just scary, I think.

00:36:31.180 - 00:36:49.560

But still, you know, we said, ‘Oh, God is great. Something will happen.’ And it did! Like, you know, what a chance. And so what was your husband’s job?

00:36:49.560 - 00:37:05.270

Oh, he—he was a flight dispatcher, for the plane. But he gave the exams in Miami for the flight dispatchers ref—refreshing course; he did it again and for that. And then when he applied

00:37:05.370 - 00:37:19.830

for a job, he was told that he can’t have a job—this job—because he wasn’t American subject. You have to be an American citizen to get this job. So we, to get an American citizenship, we

00:37:19.830 - 00:37:34.470

have to wait six years!—after we come to Houston, I mean after we come to America. So six years is too long a time to be without job and wait for that job—and that too, we were not sure whether he’d work in Houston.

00:37:35.210 - 00:37:47.060

He might be sent anywhere, you know, remote place. And all the beginners were always sent there, you know, some remote place. So we said, ‘No, forget it.’ And we just take up any job we like.

00:37:47.780 - 00:38:02.260

So he joined hotel—this uh, Hyatt Regency Hotel. And he was working there. And uhm, he was happy too! You know. So wherever we went on a trip, we

00:38:02.260 - 00:38:20.970

had uh, uhm, hotels were free for us. Because he was working for Hyatt and he had made some friends—and if those people were posted in—especially in Florida, they were posted from one place to the other, so all of them knew in Florida.

00:38:21.350 - 00:38:39.070

So we spend good time in Florida Hyatt Regency. Uhm, have you or your husband ever experienced—or your family—experienced any kind of discrimination or prejudice?

00:38:39.070 - 00:38:49.100

No, I don’t think so. At least, I never felt that because it was all Japanese. They, they would not discriminate me for whom.

00:38:50.180 - 00:39:06.110

They were not Japanese coming for this kind of work, they were all, you know, managers of certain products or something. Only those people came. And then when they come here, they appoint secretaries for them—who just take

00:39:06.110 - 00:39:20.430

shorthand and typing and type out things and give them, that’s all, so there was no discrimination. What about in your neighborhood? Or just – No, never, nobody, nobody.

00:39:21.970 - 00:39:31.630

I-I don’t mix very much with the neighbors. I mean, I-I don’t get a chance to mix. I mean, we just have some block parties in the neighborhood—I

00:39:32.160 - 00:39:48.190

attend that and just talk to people, that’s all. There’s no discrimination; no, no nothing. If I was working in any other place there would have been, in American company.

00:39:49.080 - 00:40:02.020

I’m sure there would have been some discrimination or something. Do you think there was with the Gerber, uhm, company? What—Gerber company, what?

00:40:02.990 - 00:40:12.240

Discrimination with their – It was not discrimin—they can’t—they do not trust us. Like, you know, they think that all foreigners don’t know anything.

00:40:13.270 - 00:40:34.040

Like, you know, they think that they’re all—what to call, not of their standard. Mmmm. Mmmm, as—I don’t know if you know, but our theme for the interview is labor and capital.

00:40:34.860 - 00:40:46.480

So if you don’t mind, do you remember, like, your pay? Or how much things cost when you first moved to Houston? My pay? First move was $450 dollars, I say.

00:40:46.480 - 00:40:59.030

And then like rent? Or – Raise every year, I got a good raise. On the very first year I got 15% raise. It’s because they

00:40:59.030 - 00:41:12.970

thought—my manager thought that I was taken on a very low salary. So, he gave me a raise of 14%—ah 15%. And that helped me pay my mortgage!

00:41:14.140 - 00:41:30.900

For this house, a little bit. And then to – that, to, after that, you know, always not less than 8%. So when you first came to Houston, you came directly and were living in this house?

00:41:31.570 - 00:41:51.160

No, not in this house. When I came here I stayed with my brother in his house. And then we moved here—then we bought this house. And we—I was paying mortgage.

00:41:51.160 - 00:42:02.760

Yeah, when I was there, I paid the—the balance of the mortgage first. Because I got my savings from the company. Like, you know there was a scheme, what is it called?

00:42:03.440 - 00:42:17.240

401K? And uh, if you put in 6%, the company pays 4%. If you put 4%, the company pays 3% or something like that,

00:42:18.020 - 00:42:27.250

and I paid the maximum. And so I got the maximum from company. And that was a good amount that I made, you know. Total amount.

00:42:28.390 - 00:42:47.020

Something like 124—125,000. So I paid up my mortgage—balance of mortgage first. Then, then of course we had no mortgage and cars; we had always bought it,

00:42:47.750 - 00:43:01.570

write down, because my living expenses very small. It’s not very big. I don’t—we don’t, you know, spend too much, but whatever I had, I

00:43:07.270 - 00:43:23.420

had. So when you moved from Bombay to Karachi, how long did you stay in Karachi? Eleven years. And so, what was your reason for moving to Karachi? What you say? The reason for moving from Bombay to Karachi.

00:43:23.820 - 00:43:41.280

Because my husband came from Karachi. So we got married, and then he—I had to move to Karachi. How—what was the difference between living in the Parsi colony in Bombay and living in

00:43:41.280 - 00:43:56.240

Karachi? Not very much difference, but Karachi also had Parsi colonies. And uh, you know, we were living in Parsi colony in Karachi also. Karachi was much more cleaner than Bombay—in those days. Now it’s not.

00:43:56.350 - 00:44:14.610

And so, what was the difference then between living in the Parsi colony and coming to Houston and not living in the Parsi –

00:44:14.670 - 00:44:24.670

No, but coming to Houston, you know, after having the Center here, it looks like we are in a Parsi colony, you know! Because all Parsis come there. Whenever we have any sort of a program

00:44:24.720 - 00:44:44.060

or anything. So, just to update me, what other languages do you speak? Besides English? Eh, Indian languages, I speak, like Marathi and Gujarati.

00:44:45.660 - 00:45:07.550

At home we speak Gujarati. Do you speak, uhm, these Indian languages to your children? Few of the Indian Marathi and Gujarati and what else? And of course English is there.

00:45:07.700 - 00:45:32.360

You speak Urdu? Urdu. And Hindi? Hindi, yeah. Hindi and Urdu. Hindi also, I gave four exams of Hindi.

00:45:32.980 - 00:45:48.080

So I could read and speak Hindi. But now I’ve – cause I’ve forgotten very much of it. And how old is your son now? He’s 45. And he has his own family?

00:45:48.140 - 00:46:00.650

No, he’s not married yet. He likes Chinese girls! No, I’m joking. But, not married? No, not married yet.

00:46:02.160 - 00:46:14.650

Now, we have to find a girl for him. He’s getting too old. So are you looking for a girl? Not really! But if somebody comes in my way, I’ll show him!

00:46:14.710 - 00:46:31.320

And what is his job? Your son’s job? Job? Oh he has his own business. He does ah, special events in the city.

00:46:32.810 - 00:46:46.400

Like in the city, he has some—some event, like bicycle riding or walk, uhm, marathon, walking marathon—so all those things, he manages all that. He supplies generators, chairs, tables, tents,

00:46:50.090 - 00:47:05.860

carpets; whatever you want him to do, he’ll do it for you. And so, he did most of his schooling in Karachi? No, he was here with me, for so many years. He went to school here! He started his uh,

00:47:07.080 - 00:47:23.820

primary education from—in Kolter School, elementary school. And then he went to Johnston Junior High School, and then he went to Bellaire High School. Then he went to University of

00:47:23.820 - 00:47:37.570

Houston College. Does he also speak all of these – No, no, no. No language. No language? Gujarati, which I speak, we speak at home.

00:47:38.270 - 00:47:50.370

He understands, but he cannot speak. You know, if I say something in Gujarati, he’ll understand me and he’ll reply me, but not in the full sentence.

00:47:54.300 - 00:48:09.030

But no, no other Indian languages he speaks, only English. So he’s more Americanized? Oh yes. No, but there’s a Zoroastrian too, you know? He’s got some roots there. So are many of his friends Zoroastrian?

00:48:09.060 - 00:48:20.370

Or – No, they’re all Jews! So what kind of Zoroastrian, uh, customs and uhm, practices does he still keep? What kind of what?

00:48:20.400 - 00:48:38.790

Zoroastrian customs? Mhm. And what else? Uh, like practices. Does your son—does he still keep them? Eh, he doesn’t practice everything, like, you know.

00:48:39.460 - 00:48:53.110

He just—if I say a small prayer, I say, ‘Come on, say a small prayer.’ He does that. And then, you know, I see Zoroastrian calendar all that, every day. But he doesn’t know anything, you know.

00:48:53.710 - 00:49:04.720

Because it’s written in Gujarati, so he can’t read. You want to see one? Okay, I’ll show you. And I’ll tell you some—about regarding that.

00:49:05.380 - 00:49:18.340

When we came here, her husband—although he’s not a priest—was the one that would do all the ceremonies. And so, you know, any of the ceremonies that—for a new house or anything.

00:49:18.900 - 00:49:31.980

And that’s when she was asking about when we went to Dallas, uh, uh earlier we were talking about it. Even to Dallas, he would go and do the ceremonies. And so he was the unofficial—kind of head of

00:49:32.600 - 00:49:44.970

the religious community, in that sense, when they came here. Because there just wasn’t anyone else to, to do ceremonies that knew them and stuff. And he knew them as well as any priest.

00:49:46.110 - 00:50:03.680

So. If you want to stop at that point. Uhm, so do you also interact with the Indian community here in Houston? Sometimes, not very much. But, you know, few friends that we have.

00:50:06.270 - 00:50:22.460

Actually, they’re my brother’s friends because he came here first and there were, you know, few Indians who were in Rice University. They are his friends and they became our friends too. And so how

00:50:22.460 - 00:50:34.880

was it raising your son here in America? Like, what do you think the differences were, maybe? Not very much difference.

00:50:35.440 - 00:50:49.430

He’s growing up in Parsi house and uh, Parsis are around him. And he knows all our friends. If not, physical, but at least as knows as friends.

00:50:50.710 - 00:51:01.420

So they are Parsis, of course. But he went to the Houston schools. Yes, he went to Houston school. So how was that? It was good.

00:51:01.480 - 00:51:18.100

You know, I mean, he did well. He, he went to University of Houston after that. And he did his—took his degree in Hotel Management. And he also joined Coast Guard,

00:51:20.080 - 00:51:31.540

uhm, before he joined University of Houston and he was uhm, he loves water. All sorts of water sports he does.

00:51:31.560 - 00:51:47.690

He’s uh, instructor for scuba diving. He belongs to Miami School of Scuba Diving. And uh, so, he does all that. He likes that.

00:51:47.690 - 00:52:12.940

And then, uh, this Coast Guard school—military school— took his, uhm, degree in, uhm, what is it called? Management? Some—hmm. Where they learn all sort of repair work.

00:52:13.000 - 00:52:29.140

So did—were you ever involved in his schools? Or did you go there? I-I was not very much—I was involved in his school.

00:52:30.470 - 00:52:44.820

But, eh, I was involved in a sense that whenever there’s anything, they call me, and I’ll go. And, you know, but nothing much.

00:52:44.850 - 00:53:09.570

Even this Japanese thing, that uh, doll. Anything else? We actually did some research on Zoroas—Zoroastr—Zoroastr – Zoroastrianism.

00:53:09.670 - 00:53:21.090

Zoroastrianism. And I noticed that, uhm, is it optional to have your head covered? Or is it normally required? It’s optional. It’s optional? When you pray, of course, you must cover your head.

00:53:22.650 - 00:53:36.870

Or when there are any sort of prayers going on and if you attend that, you have to cover your head. That’s all. Otherwise, no restrictions like, you know, if you don’t cover your head, don’t sit

00:53:38.220 - 00:53:54.870

there for the prayers. So the priest cover their heads for all prayers. Usually everybody covers their heads. So is it similar to like, Islam?

00:53:55.390 - 00:54:09.510

No, no it’s not, not similar, no. This was the oldest religion, Zoroastrian. So I mean after that all these other religions came, prophets came and they all

00:54:09.660 - 00:54:23.650

said the same thing. All religions are usually the same. Nobody’s going to tell you: ‘Tell a lie!’ or: ‘Go and rob somebody!’ or: ‘Cheat-cheat somebody.’ So, see, that’s religion.

00:54:24.630 - 00:54:41.980

We believe that there’s no religion higher than truth. Uhm, and so how have you seen your Zoroastrian community grow? And your—the center

00:54:42.620 - 00:54:55.310

that you started, grow? Very much so. I mean, it’s—everyday there’s somebody new coming to Houston. Right from here, from America also, because people like the climate here.

00:54:56.240 - 00:55:10.130

Once they visit their friends, they like it here. So they come here, and settle down. They were also somewhere—where were you, Pearline, before you? Oklahoma. In Oklahoma.

00:55:10.700 - 00:55:24.560

Before they came here. And so what was the experience building the center? Because you led the center—like the actual building of it?

00:55:24.930 - 00:55:40.060

Yes. We—I mean, of course, center is like a, another home for us. Like, you know. Like how did you organize the construction and everything?

00:55:41.850 - 00:56:00.480

Construction? Oh, there were other people who have also, like, you’ve met Aban Rustomji? No? No. Someone else was interviewing her today. Mhm. Her husband was very much involved in this, uh, thing. And so,

00:56:03.140 - 00:56:30.210

we, uhm, he was giving instructions what we need because he’s an engineer. Anything else? Uhm, so how often do you visit India now? India? It depends if-if there’s anything, you know, when we had our cousin’s

00:56:30.320 - 00:56:46.500

children got married or something like that, we attend it. Or, now, year before last, I mean, not this year, year before that, my sister had a fall, so there’s nobody to look after her and doctor says, ‘Unless

00:56:46.530 - 00:57:00.990

there’s somebody in the house, I won’t let her go home.’ So I had to go there and see and you know; so I stayed there for six months. So like that, if something comes up, then we go.

00:57:02.160 - 00:57:18.290

Otherwise, not very often. Okay, I think we can end with uhm, one more question. Ah, okay. Uh, what do you consider your greatest accomplishment so

00:57:19.820 - 00:57:37.870

far? What have I accomplished? Or what do you think your greatest accomplishment is? Hmm. It’s, what do I tell you? Good life. Like, you know, not too very difficult

00:57:38.510 - 00:57:54.400

life and we actually saved money, uh, because, you know. You have all the other—there you have to spend so much money on—servants to help you out.

00:57:55.510 - 00:58:08.770

Here we did everything by hand. Of course the machines are there like vacuum cleaner and this mopping machine and this thing and that thing and everything. It’s a better life here.

00:58:12.630 - 00:58:18.790

Well thank you so much. You’re welcome. Thank you. Come again! Not with this.