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Hello, today is December 9th, 2019, and we're in Fondren Library interviewing Mrs. Chienli Wu. My name is AnhThu Dang, and we shall now start the interview. So, hello Mrs.

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Wu, can you tell me where and when you were born? Hi. Okay, uh, I was born in Taiwan, Taipei, uh huh in uh 1955.

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Okay. So could you tell me about your family and the community that you were born into? Okay uh, actually, besides my parents—uh my father is a banker—uh I have a… uh my

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grandma was living with us that time, and I have two elder sisters. So it's just a very common, normal yeah, family. Mm, and so why your parents decide to move to Taiwan?

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Did they have to encounter any difficulties with the Chinese civil war, or Communist rule? Kind of, because my father worked for a bank, so basically he’s moving you know with the

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bank, the whole group together to Taiwan, yeah. And as a daughter in your family, what were your, some of your responsibilities growing up? Mm, that time... that time actually,

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my family is—how to say—is a very mid... mid uh… income family. So since I'm the youngest one, actually I don't have to worry anything about

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what happened in the family, yeah. And my both uh, sisters are a lot older than me, so they are—one is 9 years older than me, one is 8 years older than me. So I just enjoy the family time.

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Actually I think I'm the spoiled kids. Um, so what would you say are some values that you learned from your family and community? Oh yeah, that time, mm... I think my main job, as a kid,

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you know of course study is my main thing I have to focus on. And uh, um a lot of time—we're a very close family, you know my sister, you know my mother, my parents always taking me to wherever they

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go, so we are very very close. And do you follow any religions? Mm, generally my family is Buddhisim. Uh for myself, I'm not that much deep into study

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that thing, but it just—just get the general idea from my parents. And so what did you imagine yourself would become when you were younger? You mean what I will become? Mhm, do you imagine yourself becoming in like, in what career?

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Oh okay, yeah, at that time the most one—the, from the movie I guess or something, from the novel, I—⁠ I just like to be a scientist. And then I loved math most.

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So much different, I just loved math that time. And did you continue to study math in college? Yeah, I majored in math in Taiwan—National Taiwan University.

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Yeah. Uh the… also, it's that time, I think that's the time we are more, start familiar with computers. So also I like—no uh, took a lot of computer class.

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So I like a lot of like uh, art design, all those things. Yeah. And so what made you decide not to pursue um, math, scientist career anymore? Mm, many—well, till now I still like

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math. Okay, but uh, yeah many reasons. Um, after graduating from college, I didn't really continue my major... education. So I...

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you know came to America, I studied some computer science, so I mm, gradually I go into the art design field. Um, okay. And you—we know that you came to the US in the 1979, and

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lived in Orlando during your first years here. And so why did you decide to immigrate to US? Mm, well mainly because of my husband, yeah. We met in college, and then he came America

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earlier than me, so we married so I came here, so since then, basically family is my first priority. Yeah. And is there a reason why you chose Orlando to settle down at first? That's because my husband's there.

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Yeah, yeah yeah, because he works there, so I went there. First I took some classes, I say—in the University of Orlando, the Central Florida University. Yeah, so we've been there like two, three years, then we moved to

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Houston. Yeah. Okay. And what was your first impression about America? Actually I... first sight, I—I like here, because Taiwan basically is a very small and crowded

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place. Especially I—all my life I've been in Taipei. So many people everywhere. So first I came Orlando, it's a big land, there's a lot of citrus trees, you know

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orange everywhere. It's very different and f⁠— basically, mm... people are very friendly. You know because when I first got here,

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of course, the English is not that good. I can read, I can... listen, you know I can understand, but it's hard for me to start conversation, to talk.

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So I did—met couple, you know become my very good friend, then they, they you know help me to fit in the community here, fit in to the -- or help me to... more familiar what to do and how to talk.

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Those friends helped me a lot. And so was America any different from what you had imagined when you were in Taiwan? Mm, not really. Because that time, of course from movie or something, you

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know you can see the—over here is lot of like independent house, you know people have their own yard everything. That's what I'd like to be have— you know like to have. So but in Taiwan, it's more like uh,

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apartment here, everybody live in uh high rise building things, so. Yeah, I like more living freedom, so. Yeah I feel like—of course I, first few years, I missed what we have in Taipei.

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You know, at night we can go to night market and you know everywhere is bright, everybody walk on the street. Over here, sun down, everybody home, the street is empty.

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It's, it's different. It's very different. But I enjoy it, yeah, I guess it's my personality, I like the quiet. Um and so did you face any difficulties or culture shocks when you first arrived?

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It did take me a while. Because as I say, even I like it, but still it's very different. Especially— uh, besides my husband, all my family's still in Taiwan. So I missed them a lot, especially the first

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two, three years. Uh I did went to like a language school to you know improve my English, but once I make some friends, then things okay, yeah.

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And so how long did it take you to totally get used to America? Mm, I would say two, three years. Yeah. Um, so you have mentioned that you have like a lot of things about America when you first

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arrived. Is there anything that you didn't like? Mm, think about it, I really don't know! Yeah, because actually first—as I say, first couple years, I did went to uh, the went to the college, take some

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class. Because the, I also be the assistant teaching... get some part-time job in school. So all the teacher, professor, you know, start to

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making friends. Yeah, before, it's more lonely because every day's just, talk with my husband. Then my neighbors, my friends from school, then gradually I have more and more friends. Then, I really

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don't think I have anything specially I don't like it. Because I like a variety of food so food is not the problem with me. Yeah, I—I think just lo—⁠ , in the beginning, lonely is a big problem, yeah.

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And so you mentioned that your first job in America was working at McDonald's. So could you tell us more about the job? Yeah, as I say, in Taiwan, I'm just student. And actually I worked a couple years in the uh,

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government, scientific uh institute for a couple years before I came out. Then I never worked in a- a retail store or anything before. But uh, I just think it's fun.

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Yeah, it's different than what I did before. But it's fun, it's good uh, environment to learn language, to talk, yeah. Because I, I, I—the

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thing that I really like is, the people here, I don't know today's the same or not. But that time, 30 something, 40 years ago, you know people see you are the foreign people, they will talk slow, you

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know to let you understand. So I think it's fine. Very different, I think uh—oh, one time, it's something I didn’t think about we went to—we tried to

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buy a car, and the salesman—we were talking about football. In Taiwan, I never really watched football before, American football. All we did is soccer basically, soccer in Taiwan.

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So I said, "We don't know anything about football." That salesman was so upset! He's a big fan of football. He can't imagine a world that’s the people don't know football. So I, that time, me and my

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husband… even now, we still think about it, we still laughing at that. We were shocked that the people—that person would be so upset because we don't know football. It's funny.

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Um, and so at McDonald's, what were your job responsibilities, what did you do? Oh I'm the uh, register, yeah. So that's a good chance, good way for me to learn English. Because I really don't know why they put me in front instead of

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kitchen. But that's good. I don't like work the kitchen, I don't like the oil, those things too much. But uh, it's good chance for me to talk with people, yeah.

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Um, so what are some difficulties you had to go through when you were doing the job? Mm, counting money's not a problem. Oh—yeah, there's one thing different.

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In Taiwan we count the money—okay, for example, I give you change. Two dollars, ten cents, I say, "Okay, two dollars, ten cents." But in here, they count it backwards. Okay, they will count it— okay

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they give you, suppose I give you—if you give me ten dollars, I give you change. I will count back, "Ten cents make eight dollar, nine dollar, ten dollar." That's something I have to learn, it's different way to counting money.

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To make change, yeah. Yeah. And how long did you work at McDonald’s? Only a few months. Yeah, then school started, I went to school, yeah. Yeah. And so um, you said that you moved to Houston

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three years later, when you arrived in America. And so why did you choose Houston? Mm, well one of the reasons, because my uh, husband's brother—brother-in-law is in Houston.

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He keep you know, want us to move together, to live closer by. And also, that time Orlando is a very... country, very small place. I think that time just—Disney, uh, Disney

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just went there. Uh, the time we left I think they just start building the Epcot Center, it's not even finished yet. So Houston of course is a bigger city, there's more chance, more you know, more opportunity.

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So we say, "Okay, you know, family is⁠—my husband family's here, it's a bigger city, more close to what we have grown up..." like more—closer, more like Taipei.

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So its more modern city. So we say, "Okay, let's come here." Mhm. And so you have settled down Houston ever since your moving here?

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So what are the things that you like about this city? As I say, we see more big buildings more here. That time in Orlando, you see—you don't see too many modern, high buildings, the big buildings over

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there. Then, mm... just have a little more familiar feeling here. Of course, family is the very main reason we stay here, yeah. Um, and since you immigrated to the US do you recall any specific

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incidents leading you to major decisions like choices of your business? Okay. Yeah, that's after we moved to Houston, that's when we start looking for business that we can go with.

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And yeah uh, in between, because my sister uh has a restaurant, so first we try that one. But it took too many hours to run a restaurant business.

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So we start to have a family so I think that's not a good way, because I don't have too much time with the kids. So we went to the printing business. And we stayed in printing business till now because

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one thing, printing business, we only open five days. One thing. Another thing is, as I say, I uh, I like art design, so in a printing business

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I'm the one take care of the designing... typeset, art design part, so that's what I like to do. And um, we learned that before you opened your printing business, you started your first

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business here, which is the One-Hour Martinizing Cleaner. And at the time you were very young, you were only 27. So what motivated you to like open business at such a young

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age? Okay, uh, actually as an immigrant, that was a difficulty part. I was, as I say I was major in— college, it was math.

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Actually two years I work in Taiwan, I was uh, my main job is working in the missile navigation uh part of the navigation things. So it's more—that kind of field is more involved

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to uh, national security things. So first, I came to America, uh in Orlando I applied jobs, uh, tried to get into that field, but I can't.

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Because even I'm an immigrant but I'm not a citizen. I won't pass the security check. So, but after—since I didn't study in that field, you know, continuously, so after a few

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years, even I got the citizenship I cannot you know get into that field anymore. So that's one thing... I won't say regret, but just you know, just something is hard for me to find—that time, it's hard for me

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to find a job I'm more familiar with. So I said, "Well..." and my husband said, "Okay, we'll see... uh, maybe you know go into business.

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It’s something more, we have more choice, we can do—you know, choose the one we want." So that's why, as I say, we—just some opportunity, we got the cleaner, we open a cleaner business.

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But there's nothing... we are happy to go every day to work with. So we're looking for other opportunities until we find the printing company, we both more feel comfortable to do with it, and have more time with the

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family. And at that time, was there any specific reason why you chose the cleaning business? Were there like a lot of other choices but you chose cleaning? Hm, I have to think about why. Uh... I don't know.

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I think we went to a franchise, the show. The, the—they often have a job, business show or something, we went to one of it. Then we think, "Oh, that sounds okay," something we can afford to open a

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franchise. So, so Martinizing Cleaners is a national franchise cleaner. So we just, yeah. Go into there and... that time, the reason we

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just didn't buy just whatever business was on the market is because basically, we both just uh, graduated from school, then we go to some company to work. For business, we never really go into

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any business. So it's good have uh franchise people training us to go into a new business. But uh, just something we are not very, you know as a career, we don't feel comfortable stay

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there forever, yeah. Mhm. And so what were your job responsibilities as an owner? That's a good training, good way to learn life, actually. Because we realized, doing things is not

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difficult. You know, to get job done good, is not a problem. But employee—to learning how to manage employee, I always think taking care of people

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is harder than taking care of things. But it's good training, so it's good for us to for fu—for later on, for different business, we know how to handle things.

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And you mentioned that this is—this was not a job you were very comfortable with. Um, but do you have any favorite part of the job that you enjoyed doing? Mm, you mean the cleaner? We didn't really—in that field too long.

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Yeah. So... as I say, the good part is—it's a hard job... as the cleaner. We do have several employees too.

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So we... the things I like is, from that time till now, even now we have—also have employees. We always very get along with employees. Employees always happy to work with us.

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I think it's you know, just not only you are the big boss, you also make friends with them. That's the way me and my husband like to be with. So even I say management is a little bit harder,

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but it's good for—that time we were young so it's a good experience for us to learn. Mm... you have to be handle properly—you want to be their

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friend, but you also are the boss. So you know, you have to man—balance in between, yeah. Um, and so what were some of the difficulties of that job? Mm, I don't think there's

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any really difficult... we just used to work whatever we can, the best. So I don't think that's really difficult. Just uh, uh if you talk about cleaner, one of the reasons we out of that business is also the chemistry.

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The chemical they used to cleaner, people always say probably not good for health. And uh, our both parents is kind of worried for us, they say you know,

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maybe the chemical is bad for your health—for our health. So we decided to looking for other opportunities. So we just only stayed there couple years and we left, yeah. So I've learned from you that the reason why you shifted from cleaning

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business to printing business, because like you have a passion for printing for like designing, and it offers you more time with your family, and also like the bad effects of the

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cleaning that it might... Are there other reasons or they are all that? Actually, no, health of course we don't know how much risk we have from the chem—those chemicals we used.

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Really, family is the very very big reason for, for me. Because we both into that business too many hours, involve—have to involve many hours. And the kids getting, you know we

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start to have one, two, three kids. Now, kind of I can only work part-time for the business. But running business is... I think it's good for...

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because since we don't have uh closer family really can help us to babysit the kids. So American kids, kids get off school like 3 o'clock, 2 o'clock sometimes. Then we, I did

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think—thought about if I want to find a job 9 to 5. But 9 to 5, then I cannot pick up kids every day. Of course later on, when they a little older, after school they

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sometimes learn piano or learn something, I have to you know drop them and pick them So I think running business is more freedom for me, you know my husband can cover my job. So basically we

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all work together to run one business. So easy for me to have my kids first priority, whenever they need me I can be there right away. My husband can cover my part of the job.

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So I, I think that's uh, part of the work together. And so how did your working experience in the cleaning service help you with managing the printing service?

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Sorry, I didn't get? So how did your past working experience in the cleaning business, how did it help you with managing the printing business now? Does it help, are the two closely related?

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Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, as I say, get along with employee, we learn you know through the time, we can handle things better. We learn how to handle customer better.

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Uh... you know accounting-wise of course you know—everything, you just learn from past experience, you can improve what you have right now.

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And also as I say with the kids, I have more time with them than I have uh... I volunteer in school since they're young, elementary, all the time—all the way up. Uh,

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weekends, they⁠—I took them to the Chinese school, Saturday, Sunday. I volunteer in there too. So I think uh also the volunteer experience is very good experience for me, for them, for the kids.

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You know, it's good experience for us to get along, we can work together. Not only say, "Okay, you have to eat lunch, you have to eat dinner, you have to work, you have to do homework." You

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know, besides ordering, we are, now the family we also like a friend, we can work together through the volunteer project things. You know things.

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So later on just like right now, they grow up, I still volunteer for uh, a lot of community jobs—uh, work. So the kids come back, work with me to volunteer through community service.

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So I think this very good relationship. Yeah. And so what were some of the main differences between managing the printing business and the cleaning business?

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Mm... Basically they all—they all, we call small business, you know. Then, different? Uh... Okay,

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printing business is more like uh labor. You know, the... but the printing business, especially today, everything's computerized, everything's digital. Even the printing business, we are

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in—in the business uh, 30, almost 30 years now. In the past 30 years, it's very, changing a lot. You know, we used to have like a traditional offset printing, now mostly are digital printing.

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So we have to learn a lot of things through the years to be able to catch up. So I—we just have to keep as growing, keep follow the world, yeah.

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Otherwise you will be uh, you cannot stop. You just have to follow the world. Yeah. So as a woman from Asia, do you think that you have to work extra hard to build your

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business here? Or you think that you were offered the same opportunities just like everyone else? Opportunities I would say the same. But I do think we do have to work harder. Because—I don't know just me, or—I think most of the

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women, when you are certain age, certainly your self is not important any more. Your husband, your family, your kids are more important than yourself. I don't know, I think a lot of ki—a lot of women's life is...

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So uh, just something you're willing to do. You know uh, just like uh, dinnertime, after I pick up kids like 3 o'clock. Then I have to think about, "Oh, whole family, what are we going to have dinner?" I

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have to cook dinner. I don't know, if everybody like me, then... That's what I have always think, you know, the kids have some activity to do, I'll-I’ll almost try

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to fulfill it 100%. You know. Luckily, I think me and my husband work together very well. Whatever, if just like the boy, you have a boy scout, of course my husband's

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the one who will go with him. Then I have to do whatever left in, in the company or in house, I have to finish it up. If the girl has some work, you know I have to work with

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them in school or after school, then my husband eventually will take over what I left. So I think just depends whole fam— family's working together or not.

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Of course, I think I work so hard because I take care of part of business and the family. But I think my husband worked very hard too. Because whenever I just drop

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things, I say, "Okay, I have to go because my daughter needs me right somewhere!" I just go. And my husband just, without saying anything, just, just finishes what he—whatever I dropped there. But I think the immigrants… I think that immigrant… maybe…

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I don’t know—As an immigrant, especially we’re kind of came to the American, it’s a very stress—I mean, uh unfamiliar society, that time for us.

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We just have to work together. Yeah. Yeah and so you and your husband have been working together for a very long time. Is it challenging? It’s— it is very big challenge.

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As I say, okay, uh--you open your eyes, you see each other. Then you go to work, you still see each other. That’s not an easy job.

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Then running business, of course, we have disagreements about things. Okay. Most of times, of course, we discuss. Sometimes we argue.

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Then go home with kids we have some disagreements too either. So we have to arguing. Then finally we figure out that’s not the way we can live forever like this.

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So we say okay, we solve business problem during business hours. We solve our family or some kids problem when we are home. So we, it’s better we separate; we don’t just mix everything together so—like 24

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hours we always have something to arguing. I think it’s nice, it’s luckily we have disagreement mutual agreement. So we just--something, if our point of

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view is different, we just—we just have to discuss and get a concluding on that point, on that thing. We don’t just say, one thing have been solved, and two thing three thing all piled together, then never get

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things things solved. So I think that’s good--luckily for both of us, we both agree we try to solve one thing a time. That’s why I guess we stay together, I believe that right now.

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Otherwise, I can’t imagine. Yeah. This just something we have went through, yeah. And so do you think that… Um how do you about the way that the government has been helping

00:32:56.770 - 00:33:09.560

business owners like you? Do you think there’s a way they can help you better? Yeah. The first business we have—we had—is uh we did go—we used a small bus… what we call?

00:33:09.560 - 00:33:29.240

SBA loan? We did apply for the SBA loan for the, uh that’s from the government to help, to help start with. Like uh for the, I think with parts being in America like kids going through the education,

00:33:29.280 - 00:33:46.070

there’s so many grants, scholarships you can apply for as long as, of course, the-- my kids have to study hard to get a good grade or something. But you work hard, you study hard, you will get help, you

00:33:46.800 - 00:34:00.610

know, of course they also have got a part-time job from college, they also have to work hard part time. But I think here, America just have a place, a lot of opportunities just depend you, you do have to work hard.

00:34:00.610 - 00:34:18.500

But when you work hard, you will get start uh… pay back. Okay. So now we’ll move to some of the questions more about your personal life. So could you tell me when and where did you meet your husband? Oh we met in college because uh…

00:34:20.370 - 00:34:32.670

Well actually we met in club. We both like Chinese martial art so in college, in the National Taiwanese University, we do have martial art club, so we met in there.

00:34:33.590 - 00:34:51.840

Uh… I can’t believe this—how many years … that there’s something, the hobby that we uh… I think we… Yeah that’s the perfect part that we both love that, we both have a hobby. So all these years, even when we just got married in

00:34:51.840 - 00:35:08.360

Orlando, we start volunteer in Chinese schools, in some community events, we perform. And uh even right now, in Houston, we work you know many events. Even in the Thanksgiving Parade, I-I uh, I’m

00:35:10.510 - 00:35:25.710

the president of the Legend of Taiwan, we join the Thanksgiving Parade in Downtown. You know, we teach in community center like more than 30 years. That’s also part of j—besides working, you

00:35:26.820 - 00:35:42.720

have to make a living; you know work something at least you like as a career. But also I think everybody should have a hobby to make your life more colorful. And uh now for the

00:35:43.050 - 00:36:00.810

past 5, 6 years, 7 years actually, we start the scholarship for the Chinese martial art. So I think because we both have this hobby, we both like, you know, to contribute our life to pass on the

00:36:02.080 - 00:36:18.500

culture. This is a Chinese, part of culture. It’s good for everybody’s health and lots of things. So we were both willing to spend our time, even later we already agreed once we’re retired, that’s what we are going

00:36:18.730 - 00:36:30.850

to do—keep you know work on this field. So it’s good everybody, you know, together we can support each other on this field too. You seem like you’re very passionate about martial arts.

00:36:30.980 - 00:36:40.420

So when did you start taking it? I started about 10 years old. So til now, about what? Fifty some years. Yeah yeah yeah.

00:36:40.540 - 00:36:53.120

Is it a tradition in your family that everyone takes it? Uh kind of. My father uh is a master of tai chi. So he teaches in his uh, in the bank.

00:36:53.890 - 00:37:07.000

Then my sister start to learn, so I start to learn. Then I learn different things different from, you know… from different masters. As I say, in college, I met my husband

00:37:08.980 - 00:37:23.070

through the martial arts club. Then, came to America. So once we get here, basically I have learned martial arts, Chinese martial arts… about how many years?

00:37:24.020 - 00:37:36.400

12, 14 years? 14—15 years when I get here. So basically I just have to study on my own and you know, keep learning. Then I start to teach.

00:37:37.200 - 00:37:55.460

I like to pass it around because I gain a lot of benefits through this sports. Not good only for the-- your health, or you can say, self-defense, or—you also learn a lot of knowledge

00:37:55.560 - 00:38:11.780

from that. So right now, we—my husband host an international competition, Chinese martial art competition every year in Houston. There’s more than thousand people you know join this thing.

00:38:14.470 - 00:38:28.000

We just feel we have the responsibility once we learn something very good for human beings, we like to pass on. I just feel that’s my job, we both--our job to pass it on and let more people to know about it.

00:38:28.490 - 00:38:42.020

Yeah. So we spend a lot of time on that thing, yeah. Uh… So you mentioned that you had 3 kids. So how has becoming a parent changed you? Oh yeah.

00:38:42.020 - 00:38:55.590

I changed a lot. Uh first one, as I say, because our both parents is in Taiwan, so we have to take care of kids on our own.

00:38:56.100 - 00:39:12.360

We just start our own business, it’s kind of difficult. So we do um, at that time I realized, to find that good babysitter is not an easy job.

00:39:15.160 - 00:39:31.950

I did spend a lot of time, we did spend a lot of time looking for good place, good person to take care of the kids. But-- I really admire those parents have grandparents

00:39:33.240 - 00:39:51.660

with them. So you don’t have to worry that much. Sometimes, we have to work late, we have to take the kids, you know, with me to work, that’s a difficult time. Finally the business more steady, we have more income, I can spend more time

00:39:51.660 - 00:40:04.470

with the kids at home. As I say, I like to volunteer with their school, with whatever the job they’re doing. Together we can help—I think

00:40:05.240 - 00:40:16.250

the young, it’s on me to help. So all my 3 kids like volunteer job too. You know, whenever, even right now, they grow up.

00:40:17.060 - 00:40:32.370

My oldest daughter is in different state right now. He has chance, he always go to some community place to volunteer. I think this is something I gave them, I pass on as a good

00:40:32.500 - 00:40:53.680

part about it… So right now, as I say, I volunteer teaching Chinese martial art, I volunteer to uh support an association to let young generat-young professional—some grow up

00:40:53.680 - 00:41:08.210

here, some just came from Taiwan. I have association today for them to make friends together, sometimes come uh. As I say, I have a group, we

00:41:09.830 - 00:41:27.540

have a team to join the Dragon Boat race. That’s why the--I have a few of my friends together, we build up that association to have young… Because as I say, when we came to America, I feel very lonely; I don’t know who to talk to, who can help me to know more

00:41:27.640 - 00:41:44.940

friends. So right now, I am older, so I think it’s my time to let newcoming-er, newcomer can easier to make more friends to don’t have to go through the hard time we had been through.

00:41:46.320 - 00:42:02.950

So I just try to pay back to the community because I think when I was young, a lot of people helped me so it’s my turn for me to help more people. . Yeah. And so how important it is for you to teach your children

00:42:03.190 - 00:42:15.410

about Taiwanese culture? Uh the all 3 of them have went to the weekend Chinese school. Of course, sometimes, we have difficult times make them to go to school.

00:42:15.870 - 00:42:29.960

But when they grow up, even right now, actually, they are more into to talk in Chinese, or to learn Chinese. When they young, we--we try to make them talk in Chinese at home.

00:42:31.490 - 00:42:50.500

Then when they went to school, eventually they can talk English very easily. So that time, sometimes we have to force them. So for them to listen, to you know… But it do hard for them to

00:42:50.640 - 00:43:09.040

read, even they have been through 12 years Chinese school. Sometimes still difficult for them to read uh Chinese. But right now, they are more willing… Actually they want talk to me in Chinese instead of

00:43:09.660 - 00:43:27.570

when they were young, I have to force them talking to--conversation in Chinese. Right now they—I think because today’s world is very different; they, they, they realize uh, knowing one more language is very important even for their, for their career.

00:43:27.570 - 00:43:42.130

It’s very important for that too. So right now, they are the one, just—how to say? Yeah. Sometimes when they were young, I talk Chinese to them, they

00:43:42.130 - 00:43:55.570

would talk back me in English. But right now, they are the one you know talk me in Chinese whenever they got chance. And so you mentioned that you are a member of the Wu Martial Arts

00:43:55.570 - 00:44:12.480

Association then the Legend of Taiwan, and also the Taiwan Alumni Association. And could you tell us more about how you involve with these organizations? What were your--what are your positions in each one?

00:44:12.480 - 00:44:25.540

Okay. Like uh 4 or 5? 4 years ago I was the president of the Alumni uh National Taiwan University Alumni Association.

00:44:26.520 - 00:44:46.780

That’s a time we start to uh besides, we—I make some you know seminar, or some activity to help, you know, alumni, or be together as a group. Then as I start some kind of workshop,

00:44:48.470 - 00:45:04.870

career workshop, to help those young come—young uh students just came from Taiwan to go to the greater school. Then we have, we invite some panel speaker to tell them how to fit into, once they

00:45:04.970 - 00:45:23.640

graduate how they fit into the American uh environment, how to find a job. You know, I just—we, through the Alumni Association, I want more alumni can easily to fit into this world, how to

00:45:23.740 - 00:45:42.260

find a job. And also we have some, like uh Moon Festival things. Everybody can be like a big family, can, you know, watch show, and have dinner together. Just like a big family. Also I’m the president of the

00:45:44.640 - 00:45:54.260

Business Women Association, Chinese Business Women Association. That’s a little bit different. That’s mainly is uh business woman. So we work together.

00:45:56.710 - 00:46:08.710

We—in that association, the seminar we try to offer is more into business. So we have to find some successful business women or you know share some experience.

00:46:09.970 - 00:46:30.790

Then we also do some community service things; we have always donate uh some—we make an event, get some money and donate to some uh, like a home? What do you call?

00:46:32.910 - 00:46:50.000

Uh some you know, assoc—some place they need help, yeah. And also right now, I am the president of the Legend Taiwan, as I say. It’s kinda extension of the help those young

00:46:50.120 - 00:47:08.290

people to have a place they can make more friends. And the Wu Shu Mar… Wu Martial Arts Association is uh founded by me and my husband. So we work together, try to pass down the martial

00:47:11.540 - 00:47:25.290

art parts to help more people to know what it is and everything. Yeah. And so for the martial arts, uh can you tell us about the ranking or the qualifications of it?

00:47:25.690 - 00:47:37.320

Like, so, for example, for Taekwondo and some other ones, they have the color of the belts. And so, for martial arts, what is it? Uh. Let’s put that way.

00:47:38.470 - 00:47:52.920

Martial arts, originally, we don’t have such system. But right now, we started doing that, just like the competition we are host every year. Uh the competition we have like 10

00:47:53.110 - 00:48:10.250

about rings of a different rings. We compete the form, we compete the sparring, push hand, fighting set. Then every year, we have more than 40, almost 50 judges to judge on those different rings.

00:48:10.950 - 00:48:24.210

So, of course, the gold medal, silver, bronze you know have difficult; we have give place. And the for each school, they have their own associated black belt.

00:48:24.790 - 00:48:39.090

They have their own different way to separate different level. Now for the competition, we separate 4 different level. It’s like you learn less than a year, you belong to level 1. You only compete with your same level people.

00:48:40.010 - 00:48:56.270

You—we have 1 to 2 years level 2, 2 to 3 years level 3, more than 4 years level 4. So we competing with 4 different levels, then you only compete with your own level. Then we have different instructor, you know

00:48:56.460 - 00:49:13.010

the-- as a judge to judge different--in different rings. So we try to, many years—a few years ago, right? The Olympics in Beijing, we try to get this thing in

00:49:14.850 - 00:49:30.570

the Olympics. But uh--because in martial arts, Chinese martial arts, it’s hard, not like gymnastics. It’s sometimes you have to have the fixed, say, this you get 9 points, this you get 9 points to it.

00:49:31.640 - 00:49:47.670

Because martial arts, Chinese martial arts is more like… original, it’s for self defense, for fighting like I said. So fighting says a lot of things, you have to react dur—react from the certain situation.

00:49:48.280 - 00:50:01.560

You cannot say, Okay, you fight this way you got 9.2, you fight the other way you got 9.3. It’s hard to say that way, so we still, in our field, we still try to figure out what’s the fairest

00:50:01.560 - 00:50:13.670

way to judge. So I think a lot of people still working on that thing. Mm, okay. So how does involving in these organizations help

00:50:13.670 - 00:50:26.760

you stay connected with your hometown or your culture? Those fields. Okay the Chinese martial arts, this organization, as I say is national host, when we

00:50:26.810 - 00:50:38.760

host is national competition. So it’s not only to Chinese people or Oriental people. It’s— doesn’t matter what kind of… Actually it’s more, less Oriental people; I would

00:50:38.790 - 00:50:53.400

say like 30% Oriental people. Most of them are just general American people. I like that it’s just something very common to everybody. But the rest of it like Alumni Association, like Legend

00:50:53.660 - 00:51:08.410

Taiwan, it’s more into Chinese community. So, no matter what, I just feel we are in America, I like to do whatever I can to help whatever direction I can.

00:51:09.130 - 00:51:26.250

Yeah. Mhm. And so do you consider yourself still a Taiwanese, or an American, or Taiwanese American? Something in between. Uh probably I would say I would consider I’m an

00:51:26.630 - 00:51:41.230

American from Taiwan because that’s what I am. But America give me more opportunity to do whatever I like to do.

00:51:41.500 - 00:51:55.470

But I won’t forget, just how I teach my kids too. I say you are—yes, you are American. But you inherited a lot Chinese culture. I’d like you to know more about this part—thing.

00:51:56.310 - 00:52:10.720

This is your benefit as a America… Uh what they say? We call ABC right? American-Born… Yeah. So you want take your, you want take the benefit of what

00:52:10.720 - 00:52:26.200

you own, what you have. You have more chance; you learn from us, from your parents. You have more chance to contact with Chinese culture, know something. So you want take the benefit so you can enlarge,

00:52:26.450 - 00:52:40.990

kinda enlarge yourself to, to be more successful. That’s—so why not, right? You have benefits, why don’t you just take it? And uh, but you live,

00:52:41.080 - 00:52:53.360

you born in this country, you’re just part of it. Yeah. And what parts of yourself makes you feel you’re most Taiwanese and what parts of yourself makes you feel most American?

00:52:57.200 - 00:53:08.600

I’m all Chinese. I’m all Taiwanese. I’m born in Taiwan, yes. So can I help it? What I thought to be my blood, I am

00:53:09.990 - 00:53:28.920

what I am. Even talk about language, of course I talk in Chinese a lot better than I talk in English. But uh I live in this environment, in this world, in this country in here, so I will say

00:53:28.920 - 00:53:40.790

just I won’t forget what I learn since I was kid from school or from the neighbors. What I’ve, what I’ve learnt in the past, in the first twenty some years.

00:53:42.980 - 00:54:01.370

So I—since I came here—actually I live in America more than I live in Taiwan; I have been here like 40 years already. So I have been adjust to myself, myself into what I’m living today.

00:54:02.620 - 00:54:18.750

But I won’t forget what I had learnt since I was young. Just, just, just combining together is what I am myself, right now. So I think it’s wonderful we have a good background, and we have good improvement, I have good experience.

00:54:20.340 - 00:54:34.340

Put together, that’s what I am. Um and so have you ever experienced any cases of racism here? Racism? More or less I guess. I never put it in my mind.

00:54:34.820 - 00:54:50.370

Because I always believe, what I can do is improve myself, change myself, remind myself what I can do better today than yesterday. I cannot change other people’s thought.

00:54:51.080 - 00:55:00.250

That’s what I always believe. Of course, for a moment, maybe I will be upset, why such things I’m feeling, or something. But then I say, Okay.

00:55:02.330 - 00:55:16.290

That’s—that’s his problem. That’s that person’s problem. So if he—just like I teaching tai chi for many years already, if students didn’t do

00:55:16.290 - 00:55:28.070

well, I try my best, keep teaching teaching teaching. Or he didn’t come or he quit, I feel sorry for him, because something very good, and he miss it.

00:55:28.670 - 00:55:41.730

That’s his loss; it’s not my loss. Just like the relationship man— man—you know, some people have closing mind, thinking different, culture difference thing is no good.

00:55:42.240 - 00:55:55.030

That’s his lost; it’s not mine. I just feel sorry for him. That’s the way I, I, I … That’s the way I think. So uh during the time that you teach tai chi at Rice,

00:55:55.810 - 00:56:08.960

what’s your favorite part? Favorite part? Oh I like teaching young people, really. They can easy to improve. Yeah. I

00:56:09.570 - 00:56:24.940

like—especially like this semester, the one just finished right? I really impressed they all put so much time, because I keep telling them, For one semester maybe you don’t learn that much tai chi; tai chi is not

00:56:25.200 - 00:56:39.430

easy to learn for 10, 20 hours. But I really want them to realize, you spend one semester, maybe 20 hours a semester, that’s 20 hours of your life.

00:56:39.680 - 00:56:52.690

You really don’t want to waste those 20 hours thinking I was learning, I was coming to classes for the teacher, not for me. So the very first class, I told them, You come here for yourself. The 20 hours is your life time.

00:56:53.830 - 00:57:03.850

The 20 hours of your life time. It’s not 20 hours of my life time. Okay, so, I think this semester, those young people really heard what I say.

00:57:03.850 - 00:57:15.280

That’s what I like to teach you know, when they—as a teacher, I think, when you realize your students really listen what you say, it’s most happy things in the world, really.

00:57:18.140 - 00:57:34.400

So what are some changes that you wish to see here, in Houston? In the community? Hmm. In Houston? Um for the community?

00:57:37.460 - 00:57:49.190

For… how to say… I don’t know. Because I always like to see bright side. I try to forget unhappy things. … to think

00:57:49.190 - 00:58:03.020

about… Yeah I like always see people you know help each other, those things. Some people, I know always, in the human being society, sometimes people

00:58:03.430 - 00:58:12.830

jealous each other, sometimes people say bad things about each other. But I always try not to notice those things. So I wish everybody be more

00:58:12.830 - 00:58:24.150

like me; just see the bright side. You always see happy side. And so do you um go back to Taiwan often to visit your family?

00:58:24.150 - 00:58:34.630

Uh I… All my family is here right now. So, so no—well, listen this way, my husband’s sister-in-law still in Taiwan so we went. But he—she came here every year.

00:58:35.180 - 00:58:48.840

We went back like uh 3—every 3 years, 3, 4 years. So yeah. Go back to visit is fun. Taiwan is a fun place, a beautiful place. You know, have good food and everything.

00:58:50.450 - 00:59:07.750

But frankly, I think I already used to the lifestyle here. So it’s good to go there to visit. I don’t think I’ll go back to live there. Yeah. So what are some of the biggest changes that you have noticed in Taiwan that

00:59:07.750 - 00:59:19.300

ever since you left? Oh. A lot! A lot! Very. A lot. Yeah. You know, a lot. It’s very modern.

00:59:19.680 - 00:59:31.650

I would say even more modern than Houston. It’s very advanced. And the, of course, building, transportation, everything is different. Yeah.

00:59:31.650 - 00:59:53.300

And so if your future grand grandchildren were to watch this interview, do you have anything to tell them? Um I would tell them uh, you always have the benefit to learn more Asian culture,

00:59:54.490 - 01:00:10.220

Chinese culture, don’t waste it. And uh, also, I wish you all can have more chance to travel, to know the world better.

01:00:10.600 - 01:00:23.300

You really want to open your eyesight. You don’t want to limit yourself in a small place. When you open your heart, you will be a lot happier; you will see a lot things from different views.

01:00:24.400 - 01:00:36.230

So… just be happy. And so… Are there any things that you want to share, that you feel are important to yourself that we haven’t mentioned in this interview?

01:00:37.920 - 01:00:53.210

No, I think that’s about it. That’s all I can—that’s all I have to say. Yeah. Yeah, I think it’s good chance for me to give my you know experience and uh thought about

01:00:53.570 - 01:01:06.850

people and for—just like me and my—my husband, we always think the culture is very important. And I have— we have the responsibility to pass it on.

01:01:07.360 - 01:01:24.230

And in the past years, we receive so many help from different people. We like to keep, to pass our help to other people too. So I think we can conclude the interview here. So thank you so much for coming in today and

01:01:24.230 - 01:01:27.740

sharing your experience, yeah. Thank you!