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This is Arthur Tao and this is Victoria. We're here today on May 28th, 2013 in the ST architect to interview CC Lee for the Houston Asian American archive oral history interview project. So Mr Lee, can you start off by talking about telling us a little about

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yourself? OK, thank you. I was born in 1949 November in Hainan Island. 1950 February, my parents moved to Taiwan and I was born in that big, the so called big transition time in the modern uh China's time. Uh I, I was born in China brought up

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in Taiwan. I came to the state in 1974. I went to the graduate school at Washington University in Saint Louis. Uh I graduated in 1975 December. Then I moved to Springfield, Missouri and said I got, got my first job there. I stayed there five years, I

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got, got my license and I got uh all my goal in my life was achieved. Uh Chinese has the so called the OK. And that 55 goal I all achieved when I was 30 years old. OK. Earth mouth, OK. 55 goals its, got a house, got

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a job, got a wife, got a son and got, got new degrees. So I say, holy God. And what, what should I do? Uh, since I was 30 years old. Ok. Uh, what I got my license that, that year too. So, and we got a brand

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new house. I got my son and they got me and my wife and both got, got, got a good job. Two new cars. Life is set and uh Springfield, Missouri is a small town. It's about one or 100 people's town is a nice place to retire.

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Really? However, for 30 years old, I felt I must, can do something else, right? So, so I told my wife that we need to move. She was not happy. You know, I told her that we got to go to some bigger city to have a better

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future for our Children and all that. So, so 1981 and we moved from Springfield, Missouri to Houston. I was working for a big, a big company and I had a good, good time and we designed all the school project in Saudi Arabia. Then 1983 I was

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crazy enough. I told my wife said, well, I think I'm ready. I want to open my own shop and uh and I quit my job on the 1983 April thirties. My wife was not happy at all again because she just gave our second baby's birth on

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April 6th. And then my daughter was born in 1983 April 6. I told her, I said, uh let, let me try it. I said, if I don't make it, I can always find a job. If I cannot find a job, I can always work in a

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Chinese restaurant. I said, don't worry about that. I will assure you you are not, not going to get stuffed. Well, you know, and the woman wife is more conservative, especially you got the Children family. So she told me said, well, now you are not the only

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live for yourself. Now you you have two kids. You got a wife, you got a family. Now I say, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I know that. However, I don't know why at that time I got a burning desire. I was, I just want to try

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try my own and that was uh naive and have a face to myself. I just say, hey, I'm good. OK, I can make it. So without anybody in town, man, I just quit my job, start my own. Ok? And uh and I start to send out

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all my flyer to the builders developer in town. No answer. So I pick up the phone to call them and the secretary and we block it. Ok? Because we are uh so called foreigner, right? And when you call and the people can tell from your accent.

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So, so I cannot even get through the secretary. OK. So, so, so I thought, thought about it. Um um So I found out, I said, wait a minute, how can I get into the door to see that guy? Ok. If I cannot see the boss, how

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can I sell it? Right. So that was the first the lesson I learned the so-called accessibility and we are not have the equal accessibility because you don't know people, you don't have connection. So how, how can you get your food into the door? Right? So, uh

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so if you don't have accessibility, you don't have so called opportunity, right? So number one I learned is how you can figure out a way to get into the door that take some luck. Also some hard, hard working. One day I was driving on the street,

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I saw a sign for sale sign and on the the corner property for sale. Dr a construction and development company. I got idea. So I called the phone number. I said that I'm the potential buyer. Ok. I said I want to talk to the owner, the

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secretary. Sure and get in. Well, and I was not completely uh untruth because I do have a friend who was looking for and uh the possibility to buy some property to build some warehouse. So, so as I called the number and the girl. So yeah, yeah.

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And so so the girl transfer the phone to, to the owner and the owner said Yeah, Mr Lee come over. So, so I got my portfolio, my slice prepared and in my briefcase, I went, went to see, well, that that guy is uh Mr de Austin

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young guy. Uh at that time I was 33. He was only like 29 young guy is very, very friendly guy. We talk. He said, well, Mr Lee, what do you want to do? I said, well, so we are thinking about to build a mini warehouse. Suddenly

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he become very friendly. He said, well, you know, we are the good builder and we can build, build for you all that. So, so con conversation started very friendly. He said, by the way, what do you do? I said, where is that market at? He said,

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well, some days I like to see your work. I said, hey, just by chance I got my work here. So I pull out my and my portfolio to show him uh where he saw it. And he said, well, I like it. He said, uh good job.

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So when I was leaving, I told him two sentence change my life. I said, hey, I'm Mr Austin. So if you want me to be here seven o'clock in the morning, I will be here or if you want to be, want me to be here 10

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o'clock at night, I will be here and he packed my bag. He said, I like your attitude. We will do business, ok? So I shake it and I left. So one week later Thursday afternoon, about 3 30 he called me. He said, hey, Mr Lee, I

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have a potential tenant here. And can you come over now? I'm sure. So I went there and he has a shopping center. He has a 5000 square foot, a restaurant tenant was planning to, to leave a space. So he called me over, we sit down and

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we schedule out the plan all that. And it said, uh and the tenant say, yeah, that is what I want then, Mr uh Austin asked me. He said, well, Mr Lee, can you have the drawing done by Monday? I said no problem. Ok. That that was

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like a Thursday afternoon is already five o'clock. I said no problem. So, so I went back, I jump on it, I walk, walk through Friday, Saturday, Sunday. So Monday morning, I got 15 sheets drawing down, ok? Mon Monday morning, about nine o'clock. I, I put that

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50 sheets on, on his desk. He was so impressed. He said, gosh, I never saw anybody walk so fast. He said, by the way, Mr Li, where's your office? I said, well, I still had to use my own house. He said, come over. He said, I

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got plenty of office room here and you can pick one. And he said, free, free of charge. I said, wow, I know that time that was my break. So, so I take a deep deep breath. I told him, I said, hey, Miss Austin, can I think

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about it? Can I call you back tomorrow? He said sure. So, so I was so excited. I know that was my break. So I waited to the second days about 10 o'clock. I call him. I said, hey Mr Austin, I decided to take your offer. He

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was so excited and he got the whole office set up for me. OK? So since that time on every time he got the potential tenant, he said, OK, come in, talk to my in house architect. So that is a mu mutual benefit, right? So, so that's

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how I got to start is with his connections. I start to build my and my big business, my network. OK. So uh that lesson teach me is you have to work hard in order to be successful, OK? However, only work up doesn't guarantee you successful and

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you have to have a break, so-called lock. However, the lock has to be created by you, ok? If you don't create and you not have luck, think about it. And because there are full of opportunities all surrounding us, somebody can see, somebody cannot see that, ok?

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That, that sign on that property was there for a long time when I saw it, I got idea, I call them, right? So, so I bet there must be more than 10,000 thousands of people saw, saw the sign and on on a daily basis. So and

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that, that lesson I learned is first us, Houston is a very, very open minded city if you are waiting to go for it and you always have opportunity, however, you have to create your own opportunity by visibility. OK? OK. I'm the the the the firm believer,

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visibility enhance opportunity, especially our business is a personal service business. You have to let the client know you, the client has to like you. OK? So when you do the marketing, you do the sales, you really don't sell nothing but yourself, you sell your own personality.

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Ok? So Chinese had to say the first one is, is fate. Second one is luck. Third one is fourth one is to the the fifth one. Is that OK? So the the first two, the the fate and the luck is beyond our control. OK? That's called

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the Heaven Factory is called Earth Factor. The last two, do the diligence, diligence and do the good deed that is under your control, that's called the human factor. So, and if you can only control two and they said the out of the five, your chance of

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successful is might be limited and you got to have luck or you have to have the knowledge. So that's why I said I teach course to, to people is trying to help them to enhance their chance to be successful. OK? So, so if you have knowledge

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and you also control human factor, uh if you also got the luck and you have a four out of five, so then, and the US success is secured. Ok. However, no matter what, you have to work hard, that's, that's number one. Ok. Uh To God, OK.

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Ok. So that's what I'm saying is uh and in my last 40 years journey here I learned is uh is if you want to be somebody, you got to understand yourself, to know your strength, your weakness, you have to know your passions. Actually, the fate is

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your own habit, your own personality, create your own habit, your your own habit, create your own fate, right? Think, think about it. And if you don't have a good effective habit, you cannot be successful. OK? And the special I learned is uh life is our life

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or journey is to experience. We are spiritual beings. We are not a human being, we are spiritual being has human experience. We are not a human being, have spiritual experience. So we are the true time traveler. Our body is just our rented apartment. For this period

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of time, the body will decay, the soul will travel. So we are the true time traveler and I believe reincarnation or that. So, so the purpose to come to this life is our soul require a specific specific experience. So this life and I'm a Chinese Americans

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experience my ne the next life. Who knows I might be, I might be Egyptian, black, white Hispanic. And because our soul require different experience to elevate our spiritual growth. OK. So and this take, take me 40 year search I did because when I was 20 years

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old, that was it in the Donghai University in Taiwan is a and is a Christian college. We all required to study what the religion Bible at. And in the class when I was junior year, I was challenging my professor. I said, sir, one thing I cannot

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figure it out. And he said, ask, I said, sooner or later we are going to die. Why I don't want to die? Now, why I have the desire to live as long as possible? I said, if I know I come in this world, empty hand, I'm

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going to leave this world empty hand. I said, why bother? He said a good question. So he wanted me to study Bible one on one with, with him the whole semester, the, the, the second semester in my junior year and we finished the whole New New

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Testament and the finish it. I told him, I said, sir Bible is a good book. I said his good teaching is all good. However, I didn't get the specific uh enlightenment because Confucius already said the same thing 500 years ahead or so. So he told me

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that's fine. He said time is not right for you yet. He said you continue to search uh the God sooner or later. God will find you. So, since that time on, I study a lot, a lot of religions and uh and all philosophies about the meaning

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of life, all that. So through the last last 40 year search, I finally realized every religion is same, but we all talk about the same God and especially, and as architect and there's no doubt about this is a mastermind, create the whole whole universe. OK? So

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you tell me the whole universe just happen by chance. No, I gotta be some laid out just like a restaurant and you got to hire an architect to lay out the the plan to have a, a very effective uh functional layout. So so the restaurant can

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run it very effectively so the restaurant can be profitable. However, once the restaurant finished, the design was finished, the building is built, the architect turned the key to the owner and architect left where they are no longer involved in the operation of the restaurant. So the

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same thing for me that God create the whole universe that God has designed as a plan for you. But once and he got the plan, tell you what you your life should be and God left God give you the key and you know what the key

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is. Your free will. God give you the key, the free will and you can decide you want to follow God's plan or not if you don't want. That's fine. That's your business. So say same thing to be in the business. You are continuing exploding your own

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potential. You continuing to realize God's plan for you. You never stop thinking, searching, learning because it is endless search and learning. OK. So somebody said, oh, I made it and I want to retire. I wanted to, to, to enjoy life. And I always think about, always

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question myself. What exactly means retirement? Think about life is beginning of death, death is beginning of birth. Uh OK. And the birth and death. OK. OK. So, so the whole process really is not end, think about people lost because they don't have a clear definition, meaning

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of who they are, what they want to achieve and in and in their life. OK. And uh and everybody is a leader in a certain level. OK? And the leader is a person who knows who he is, where you want to go and how he can

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help the other people to achieve their goal. That is the definition and of leader. OK? And in my life now, and I'm 63 and in my business career, life is never a smooth riding. It's always up, right? And this and this you always challenge yourself. And

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through the LA la last 40 years growth, I finally formalized my own philosophy and I'm a spiritual person, I'm not a religious person. OK? I can go to church, mosque temple. It's all fine to me because that is a communication space for human being and God

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that it OK. The format the ritual is really human create. God didn't create a religion, human create religion. Think about it. OK. So I formulated my own philosophy. I crystallize it to be two words. Challenge yourself. Did he think about it is every day? So if

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you want to feel happy, you need to challenge yourself. You work, work hard at it when you reach it and you can be really have a sense of self realization, happiness. However, the moment you reach it, it is emptiness. So then, then, then you have to

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continue to force yourself to search the se second goal, right? So, so, so that's why I thought about it. And uh I challenged myself, what is the store going to? OK. And it said uh rather than continually challenging myself, reach to the emptiness, go to go

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to another one. Challenge myself, reach with another one and say, wait a minute, why not? I just create a very high goal that's beyond my reach in my this lifetime. So, so that's why I create a store and I want to create a ST dynasty. OK?

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I told my son, my son's Victor, he's 33 years old. He is uh in the urban planning background. So he, he just joined me on the May 1st and then my daughter, she's 30. Now, she's uh major in, in the architecture too. So, so I share

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with them, I said, the kid, my goal is one to create something beyond my reach in my lifetime. I wanted you folks to carry on at this torch at this and uh to build a dynasty, it will take a minimum of three generations. It take three

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generations to build a long lasting sustainable uh business. OK. So, and I am a very patient person and I'm, I'm not looking for instant reward or that I told them, I said, and I commit myself to build this foundation for you. And the is my first

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song. And he said, I got to find somebody can take care of my first son first. I said also, and you, you are my Children. However, if you cannot take care of my son, my first son, and if you cannot share the vision, then then I

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have to find somebody else. So I, and I'm not a traditional Chinese parents is create the will the company and let the two Children take over. And I, I'm not necessarily agree that because traditional family business concept is your Children. They are the owners. However, the

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modern corporation, you have to separate the ownership and the management owner not necessarily are the good managers. OK. Yes. And you can own the company share, but you don't have to write it and you can always hire somebody more capable than you to write it. So,

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so that's why that traditional way Chinese say and that, that what they say is it's very seldom in the Chinese family business can last more than three generations, very seldom because the the second generation still can see the founding generations, hard working value, work ethics. However,

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the third generation because they didn't see it, so they didn't appreciate the funding generations vision value effort. So the third generation is very easy to not appreciate the value, the same goal vision. OK. So so in order to assure Sto dynasty can continue, and we have

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a very unique philosophy here and I would say is a very unique firm and I create this entity and with a very unique uh vision and the name of Store is uh is a very unique name. OK. Superb team of architects. OK. And that is we

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want to make, make ourselves feel. And we are the superb team team emphasize working together towards the same goal uh Store also is ancient Greek colony when, when you talk about uh uh and it's that uh ancient Greek uh uh foreign and the farm market and

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they have the the the colony, the people doing the business under the colony. OK. Also story is a source of philosophy called stoicism. When you say is very stoic, stoic is from, from store. The teaching of is very similar to the Chinese teaching the Confucius and

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Taoism to emphasize uh discipline control, your desire, have a high moral ethics standard. Uh work hard uh follow the nature's order, live a very simple life and the stoy system doesn't promote you to live a very luxury life. It's a very simple life. OK. Uh One

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thing is very important is to emphasize, individual should sacrifice your interest for the group's benefit. That is the essence of teamwork, right? So uh is a very rigid teaching. Actually, stoicism is a foundation of the whole Roman civilization and they are based on the teaching of

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OK. Yes. later on modified it. Same thing here and the store in the 21st century. So we have to use socialism as foundation but modified to fit into the modern way, right? So ba based on that, that philosophy and the way we always encourage people to

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challenge yourself is constantly push your envelope and to surprise yourself. OK? Yes, I know. I mean, challenge yourself means surprise yourself. OK. I surprise yourself is more, more appropriate. Always surprise yourself. OK. For, for example, when I was uh in 1999 I grow my company to

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a medium size. I was too big for a small job, too small for a big job. OK. I was stuck in the middle. I said, gosh, and how, where, where they said uh what, what should I do? So I talked to the people, people say, well,

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you don't have experience and you don't have this particular project track record. I said, well, if you don't give me the opportunity, how can I get the track record? Just say, well, it's not on my job. I will, will you get the experience on somewhere else?

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Then, then you're coming back? I thought about that. I said, gosh, that is a very cumbersome, right? So, ok, I got this challenge. I figure out how, how to solve it. And I just buy the track record. So that was the first uh minority architectural firm

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briefly enough to get out of my box. I go buy firms. So consequently, I bought four firms. And then my, my fi first office I purchased was in Portland, Oregon. 1999. We a small firm and I just saw on the magazine and they said, Northwest Practice

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for sale. I got idea. I just called him. I said, are, are you in Seattle? I said, no, no, we are in Portland. I said, where is Portland? I said, oh, Portland is only three hours south of Seattle. I said, ok, so from the day I

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call them on the June 17th, 1999 I close the deal by September 17th. 3 months. Ok. Ok. I don't have consultant. I just use the common sense, the business sense. I got the deal done. Ok. So, so you said that experience, I consequently bought one firm

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in Pensacola, Florida, one firm in Houston. Then 2007, I bought, bought another firm in Pensacola. So through this merger and acquisitions experience and learn something to actually every day you learn something OK. Uh To have a long distance management is difficult. Even you got the partners,

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it doesn't work because especially our business, our business is a personal, creative business. People got ego. OK? So if you are not sooner or later, your partner will fear. I don't need you because that is their effort, cell connection, cell per personal relationship. So that's why

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I elevated my company to the third level. First is that the entrepreneurial level, second level, I started to do merger and acquisition. Then the third level I started to franchise my company. OK. So that was the first, the architectural firm actually to the franchise. Uh when

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I was 60 years old. And I told my wife said, well, honey, and that your board, I said, I wanna go back to, to school. She said, you're crazy. She said, oh, your friend, your classmate is all you retired. So when I was 60 years old,

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I went to Harvard for one year program. It's called the Advanced Management Development program specialized in the real estate. And that is a very good program. I learned a lot. They, when you are in sixties, you go back to school to learn. It's different when you

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are in twenties. It's a totally different set of mind. OK. In that program, I learned a very important concept called the red ocean Blue Ocean concept. And the professor show two slides. First slice is a red colored water full of shocks. They call the red ocean.

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The sec second slice is Hawaii's nice blue water white shark. And the professor asked which market you are in? Ha Ha. Everybody point the, the red red ocean. He said, if you are in the red ocean, you got to figure out how to get into the

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blue ocean. Right? The $50,000 answer and I spent $50,000. The $50,000 answer is to it. Once you create a new business, new service, new product, you are the first like iphone ipad, and you create a brand new market for yourself. The second way is you do

00:37:31.959 - 00:37:55.669

as Walmart did 70 years ago, Walmart went to the rural area and they don't compete with, they go to small towns, set up small small grocery store. Once they are strong enough to come back to the urban centers, knock out the. So I thought about it.

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I said, you know, this is a great strategy. That's a great strategy. OK? And we are small and I cannot compete with those big boys. So, so that's why. And, and I told my staff, my Children is we are looking for a long term. OK. Look

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at Walmart takes them 70 years. OK? To grow. OK? So, so when I got that idea and I started to look for my market. Houston market, us market is a very competitive market, especially we are in a mature society now. So we are not in the

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fifties sixties in a rapid growth, the the country build building mode and we are in the mature phase. Now the mature phase means yes, we still have project but we are no longer have those mega project compared with China India, all developing country. Now they have

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mega need, they have mega project that all about as you know, the opportunity is in the blue ocean market. So what I'm doing here to fight in the red, red ocean market for. So that's why I started to look into the blue Ocean market. However, how

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how can I do it? And I started uh Shanghai office 2005. It was a partnership. However, that doesn't work very well either because and I am in Houston and the market is in China in Shanghai. And the and my partner is running the show there for

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three years. We are losing money. So, so, so there. So there's no problem the fourth year and we made, made the money. So I got a nice check and I was happy but she was not happy. OK? So 50 years she wanted to buy, buy me

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out. OK? Because she failed and I'm doing an all all the work here, right? And you you are sitting in Houston and doing nothing and I got a check, right? So this teach me also a very valuable lesson too. Every relationship is a fair trade fa

00:40:50.280 - 00:41:18.709

ir fail trade include the marriage is fair trade. And if one party don't feel that is a fair trade anymore, that a partnership that that relationship won't last. Ok. My, my learning is every relationship will got to be filtrated and you have to put yourself in

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other shoes to see what, see that, that the partnership. So, so I found out, I said, well, the current structure doesn't work even beginning you and you invest your money, your effort later on. If you are not there, sooner or later, you will be out because

00:41:48.189 - 00:42:14.280

your partner doesn't feel you put your fail contribution, right? So then based on what I learned at Harvard, the Blue Ocean concept and that my experience in Shanghai and also Pensacola too. I have to let my two junior partner in Pensacola go because after six years

00:42:14.760 - 00:42:37.590

they failed. That is their effort, their contribution and they don't feel the relationship is a fair trade and, and also I own 75% of the company and, but they still feel they are running the show. OK. So based on this experience, and I thought about as

00:42:37.600 - 00:43:04.270

you know, maybe the best way is to franchise it. OK? I don't own your company. I lend you my brand name, track record experience, resource, I support you to grow, but I don't own one, your company. So that will be much feasible way of partnership. Franchise

00:43:04.280 - 00:43:27.770

is also a form of partnership. So you have your own company and I don't own your, your company here. However, I help you to grow fast. So uh our slogan is we help small firm to grow fast. So when I got this idea, three years ago,

00:43:27.780 - 00:43:53.350

I, I talked to a friend, he is a Vietnamese engineer. I asked him to find some small firm in Vietnam so I can sell my franchise to them. And he said, well, I'm interested. I said already. So, so my first sold the franchise is during a

00:43:53.370 - 00:44:15.620

lunch. We talk, I sold it, OK? I don't have anything. OK? I don't have, I don't have slice or we just talk about the idea and he like it. So he bought it. So consequently, I sold the uh four more. I sold the one in one

00:44:15.629 - 00:44:44.060

in Hangzhou, one in Xi'an and the two in Nigeria. So now I'm looking into the Panama Turkey, Kazakhstan and the Malaysia. OK. So my goal is by 2020 I want to have a 20 locations. OK. So, and this summarize my business business career here is how,

00:44:44.100 - 00:45:07.110

how I grow up in a tough time in that the big transition time in modern Chinese history. Moved to Taiwan, come to Saint Louis, go to Springfield, come to Houston. Then how I grow from Houston to a to a global company. OK. It said that we

00:45:07.120 - 00:45:36.770

are the only Asian owned, the design firm actually have, have a global presence and it's that, that the whole philosophy is based on surprise yourself that it never ended to surprise yourself. Always challenge, challenge yourself. Yeah, when I first uh present my franchise idea at Harvard.

00:45:36.780 - 00:45:55.100

And because by the end of the year that we have to present our own thesis project, that present my power point that said, I want to create in this. And all the professor said, well, it doesn't work. I said, why not? They said because you are

00:45:55.110 - 00:46:16.689

a personal services business and you are not like a mcdonald's Burger King. And you have a standard product, tangible product. I say, hey, and if you, you shift your paradigm, that is exactly how you need a franchise because it is a localized business and you provide

00:46:16.699 - 00:46:43.419

a global image, global resource of family. Everybody can share the global resource. You help your local partner stronger and you can help them to compete in their own market better. That's what the franchise for is to help your family members stronger with all the cars and

00:46:43.429 - 00:47:12.570

on my legs because you share the knowledge and the experience. So I, so personally I think and this idea work and proved to work. I only sell them on a personal basis, which I'm not yet to, to reorganize it as a corporate way. And we are

00:47:12.580 - 00:47:32.050

more based on my personal contact way. And it said that I am not strong enough. And it said what, what I'm strong was I will be at like Walmart when I got 20 office all over the world. I will coming back to Houston Market, to U

00:47:32.060 - 00:47:59.290

US market and to surprise all, all those big boys, they will say, wow, where is this store coming from? Right. So, so that's why and I'm not uh actively promote, let it's a big boy's nose and what I'm doing. Ok. I keep low, low profile. I

00:47:59.570 - 00:48:29.459

go out and once I build the whole family structure, right? So I'm coming back, I'm going to knock out the here. OK. That's fun, right? So for, for me now, life should be fun. However, is not going in place means and do you assess where you

00:48:29.469 - 00:48:59.479

are, you decide where do you want to go and you lay out a plan, you follow your plan and if you reach it, it's great. If you don't reach it, that's fine. Say Chinese old saying that, OK. And because hard working doesn't guarantee you success. However,

00:48:59.489 - 00:49:24.800

the the life, the process count, not the result, count, the process can think about it. There's really no so called result because the result is just the beginning of another result. It's constantly evolving. OK? So that started from zero. I grow my company to a medium

00:49:24.810 - 00:49:45.989

size and I got the result. But the result, the beginning how I can grow my company by merger and acquisition. Then when I get into the third level, I reach my dream goal in us. Now I want to go to global and I want to create

00:49:46.000 - 00:50:11.090

a global dynasty. Then my fourth goal is when I got my tw 20 locations are strong enough that I'm going to come back to knock out the, the, the K Mart here. Oh Yeah, Kart here, right? So, so you constantly have a challenge for you. So

00:50:11.100 - 00:50:33.350

life is fun. So if you don't have challenge and the life is, well, that is why I always challenge my staff. I said you got to constantly review yourself. Is that who are you where you are, where you want to go? If you don't know what

00:50:33.360 - 00:50:58.500

you are doing, you just surviving, you are not leaving. Uh you know, when I was 30 years old and one time I went to Kansas City and there is a very famous museum called Nelson Art Gallery at one time. And I have a famous show and

00:50:58.510 - 00:51:20.870

I drive from Springfield to Kansas and wait in the long line I saw there is a two saying on the, the, the top of the building is well said, I said it is real re a that we survive and it is ideal. I DEA l that

00:51:20.879 - 00:51:43.000

we leave. So we needed to have ideal. Uh we need to have a dream in order to live. And otherwise we are just like just like animal dog and a cat, the same thing and we just survived. OK. So, so that's why I, I always challenge

00:51:43.010 - 00:52:05.979

my kid, my staff. I told them that I don't want you to survive. I want you to leave and you got to find yourself and that uh and that's what I learned is uh we are all godchild and there's no difference. Human nature is saying and

00:52:06.020 - 00:52:29.360

no matter you are black, Hispanic, Asian white, all same, human nature is same. So say in order to be a good businessman, in order to be actually to be a good person, you got to understand the human nature. So think, think about it and what is

00:52:29.370 - 00:53:08.389

human nature? OK? I think it is the key is is we got to aware of our surroundings is every event, every person we meet, we can always learn something from it. OK? That, that means and you have to pay attention to your surroundings, you can learn

00:53:08.399 - 00:53:39.979

from everything. So right. So so that you can learn from it from everybody and it's a good behavior, it's a good part and you can learn from them. It's a bad behavior and you have to learn how to avoid it right there is. So, so my,

00:53:40.350 - 00:54:08.429

my current assessment of my life is uh he had a good time. OK? The challenge and it's that the life is not supposed to be easy. OK? When you got to maintain a very balanced view, balanced mind, peaceful mind and to see every event happen and

00:54:08.439 - 00:54:47.459

they always have reason. OK? And the law of casualty, the cause and effect uh reason always have. So and if you want to know what you wore in your previous life, and you just see what you are experiencing now because current life is the result of

00:54:47.469 - 00:55:19.810

your previous life. Life's cause. So what they are doing now is the cost of your future life. So so so that it will give you a very good way, a rule how you behave yourself is nothing happened by chance. Ok? If they this life, you are

00:55:19.820 - 00:55:44.030

constantly encounter challenges, difficulties, don't complain. That is a result of what you did in your previous life. So what what you are doing now, you have to behave yourself well because you don't want to suffer in your future life. OK. Now that, that is a bud

00:55:44.479 - 00:56:19.030

Buddhism teaching how however, and every theory teaching and they became lost, that means they have some married. The truth is all same. OK? So that, that he said babe, basic overall view and of my life, my business and my philosophy and I'm a firm believer you

00:56:19.040 - 00:56:56.000

are who you are, you define who you are. OK. Now, as Asian American in Houston, uh I would say our challenge is as same as Black and Hispanic, I think uh comparable speaking Houston is a much open market is people are more open mind because we

00:56:56.010 - 00:57:28.580

are really international city. Uh We got uh people all over the world here. OK. Uh However, however, for the minority business to grow as Asian business. Yes, we are not in the most advantage to position because uh this is made by people and especially for us

00:57:28.590 - 00:58:01.679

and we are not home growing. OK? And we are the so called transplant. OK. So we don't have root here for us and we have to work very hard to, to grow our own root here. So that's why. And it said uh and I work day

00:58:01.689 - 00:58:29.139

and night, OK? And the breakfast, meeting, lunch, meeting, dinner, meeting Sunday uh is constantly OK? And they, and this become a the habit, you constantly meet with different people constantly and let people know who you are and what, what you're doing. And it's a never ending

00:58:29.149 - 00:59:00.159

process. OK? Uh as Asian American because we are a very small population in Houston. So trying to compete for the public resource, we are not as strong as a Black and He Hispanic community, we are not visible. So yes and in some, some times, especially our,

00:59:00.169 - 00:59:25.300

our business and that the way we are pursuing the the public sector job more uh most of our work you can see and we do the city, county airport, uh school college, the public sector job, public sector job. We are competing with the all the big

00:59:25.310 - 00:59:59.020

big boys. OK. So uh fortunately, the public sector job to have a so called the participation goal for, for the the minority firm. However, as a subcontract for a prime firm and the U pay basically, it's just like a tool and you are not driving and

00:59:59.030 - 01:00:20.520

you are not the driver. OK? So how, how you build up your strength and you can compete in this so called red, red Ocean market. I think going through the traditional way to grow is take too long. I say that taking me 30 years to build,

01:00:21.179 - 01:00:52.139

to build, to build this foundation, but still take another two generations OK. Set. uh and especially the timing too of say, unlike the fa famous church, Chinese architect, Im OK. And uh Frank speaking, there are thousands Chinese architect as talent and as I ma in us.

01:00:52.780 - 01:01:12.020

But he was in the right time, right place. OK. And he was in the New York City right after world war two and it's the whole country is building. So, so he was in the right time, however now and it's the and the whole economy coming

01:01:12.030 - 01:01:38.570

down, we are not in the right time right place in us. However, how can we take advantage of your your US that the the US still have the global respect. If you are a US firm, you go to the developing country, people pay respect. So how

01:01:38.580 - 01:02:08.750

you can take advantage of this? You are the US firm, you help the low, low local partner to compete in the local market. OK. So that, so that is my current current uh uh thinking and that approach is how, how can I help first, the local

01:02:08.760 - 01:02:37.169

market can still grow slowly but emphasize in in the global market. So that's why I plan is is to bring my son back this year, my daughter back next year and led them to run the Houston office and I will have time to, to expand the

01:02:37.179 - 01:03:02.979

and in the global market. OK. So and everything got to to go through the process and you got to be patient, the more the most the small firm fail if they are not a patient. And, and in order to be successful, you got to be persistent

01:03:02.989 - 01:03:31.419

patient. OK? And also I learned when you are at the most successful time, this is the time. That's the time and you need to be specifically be careful, right? PG OK? It's when you are at the top of the mountain, the only direction you can go

01:03:31.429 - 01:03:52.689

is go down and when you are at the bottom of the valley, the only direction you can go is go up. So it's a simple job by so and all my girls in the U US in the Houston market, I learned the more I grow, the

01:03:52.699 - 01:04:20.590

more life experience, I get, the more I appreciate that Chinese teaching that Con Confucius teaching, excellent teaching. Oh yeah. So and that's what I feel all the church, Chinese church generations. Unlike my son, my daughter, I told them that you need to read some Chinese philosophy,

01:04:20.600 - 01:04:50.100

Confucius and Taoism and you can be more and it's more appreciative then I wouldn't who you are. OK. So we, we are very lucky as Chinese living in us. Uh OK, we have the benefit of the both sides, the both sides. OK? You have the traditional

01:04:50.110 - 01:05:19.459

learning, but you live in a western society, you can also see how they are civilization based and you can compare uh where you can uh handle the issue much, much better. OK. It's OK. So we need to too complimentary to, to, to. OK. Is that it?

01:05:19.600 - 01:05:41.469

So now you got any questions? Um So you mentioned that it's very important to know yourself to be a leader. So I guess going way back, how did you know that you wanted to study architecture? Uh uh Well, you know, I bumped in to architecture pure

01:05:41.479 - 01:06:07.300

by chance. And because, because in Taiwan system, when I graduate from high school and you have to take a national college exam is a unified test. You fill in your choices, options on the different uh department of the different the university you fill in, then your

01:06:07.310 - 01:06:30.159

score will match with that uh field. So uh and in my score, I just meet into the architecture to department. I don't have sli idea what's the difference between architecture and the civil engineer. I don't have sli idea and what I guess is uh fate and

01:06:30.169 - 01:06:49.629

uh we do have the so called the fate factor there. I just pumped into it and that I consider myself as a born architect. It's so easy for me. So I will, and I must be, be a blessed and I must do something. Right. And in

01:06:49.639 - 01:07:22.129

my previous life you were born in 1949 in Hainan and the, the communist army took over the island. Uh Haikou Pacific in April, I think 1950. Um What was the circumstances when surrounding your family when you were born? Well, you know that when my parents came

01:07:22.139 - 01:07:46.610

to Taiwan, we are very poor or we don't have nothing. Ok. Yeah, seriously. My and my mother told me they left the Hainan in 19 fifties, February and I was only like 44 months old. And uh and we have to, and my mother ha ha has

01:07:46.620 - 01:08:06.340

to wrap me and with a, a blanket, put me on top of a big cargo box and then, and they said that they got the arm and the arm and take the box out and to, to, to the boat, the boat is very high, right? Uh

01:08:06.350 - 01:08:33.020

Because my parents had to climb the and this uh uh the rope climb up to the boat. Ok. They cannot hold me to. So, yes, I was. And my mother said, gosh, she said if I got the wind to blow it or if I go down

01:08:33.029 - 01:08:57.770

to the ocean, it's gone. There's no where, where there's no way to save me. Yeah, because, uh, because, and at that time everybody wanted to and everybody want to get on the boat as a chaotic moment. Yeah. So then we come to Taiwan where, you know,

01:08:57.779 - 01:09:22.450

we don't have anything. So my and my father finally found a teaching job and in a high school in the middle of Taiwan and he said we move, move over there then and then my father found, found another teaching job in Taipei. So then that's so,

01:09:22.640 - 01:09:44.990

so I was in Taipei when I was six years old. So then, then, then I was grow up in Taipei. Your father is from, and your, and your mother is from Hubei, right? How did they meet? Uh let's see, I heard is uh my father went

01:09:45.000 - 01:10:14.240

to college and we met at the Yeah. OK. At the Hubei College. Um Did your mother ever work in Taiwan? Yes. Yeah. My, and then my mother, she is a teacher and at the grade school and then my father, he was a math professor and in

01:10:14.250 - 01:10:41.430

a college in Taipei, were they connected to the um republic government because they went, they ended up in Taiwan instead of staying in the mainland. Uh They are not necessarily connect with uh the women don't know. And it's uh and they just uh at that time

01:10:41.439 - 01:11:05.049

they are young too and it's, they are ear early 2020. So, and they just don't want to be either the communist the routine. Um Did you meet your wife in Taiwan? Yes. And it said I was uh ok. I was in college. She, she, she was

01:11:05.060 - 01:11:39.419

in college. Yeah. You gave that one in here. And your name is as in Chinese. We have a family name. Our middle one is our, is our, our generation name and all my sister, my brother is all God. Ok. I am that the third character is

01:11:39.430 - 01:12:09.290

my real name and that is, and we use the place that we were born. So, Miss, because she was born in Taiwan. Ok. Now. Ok. Yeah. Um, where are your siblings now? Oh, where are your siblings? Oh, well, they all in Houston. Yeah. Yeah. My, and

01:12:09.299 - 01:12:37.140

then my sister is, uh, she was, she was an accountant. My brother just retired and he moved from Dallas to here now. He, he is a phd in the statistics. Yeah. Do they come here because of you? Yeah. Well, because my family and my mother is

01:12:37.149 - 01:12:57.390

here too. Yeah. So my mother, my younger sister, brother is all here. How did you choose, um, when you were deciding where to go for was, well, just by chance too when I applied the one school on the east coast, one school on the west coast,

01:12:57.399 - 01:13:20.450

one school in the middle and it was, and they gave me a scholarship. So, hey, I'm coming here. So there was a two year gap between you graduated from Hai University and, yeah. And in Taiwan, every boy needed to go to the military services. So I

01:13:20.459 - 01:13:42.120

graduated in 72. I have to go to army for two years. So, so 72 to 74. And that was in army. You served in the army? Yes. Right here. Uh, and that time the, the, the relationship between the mainland and Taiwan is still a little tense.

01:13:42.129 - 01:14:01.529

Did you, were you in combat? Did you experience any sort of conflict? No. No. And it said that we, we are based in Taiwan. So ba basically just a typical m military service. Yeah. How much were you paid? Um, how much were you paid while you

01:14:01.540 - 01:14:27.649

were in service? Service was cheap. Oh, gosh, I cannot remember it so little. And we cannot just, uh, I would say just a, a minimum pay payment. Yeah. So we, we don't have any expense anyway. Was that you, you and live in the military base? 24

01:14:27.660 - 01:14:46.169

7? So, yeah. Oh, were you already married by then or did you after? Yeah. And I met, I actually, I met my wife in a party where I was in the military service. Then it said I came to Saint Louis then, then she followed me and

01:14:46.180 - 01:15:11.020

we, and we were married in Saint Louis. The 1974 is Christmas. Yeah. And your son was born in Missouri? Yes. Yes. My son was born in Springfield, Missouri. And then my daughter, she, she was born in Houston. Yeah. How did your parents ended up in um

01:15:11.029 - 01:15:43.270

Hainan. Oh, well, you know, at the, at the 1949 the Communist State taking over slowly. So, so they moved from Wuhan to teaching was my father was teaching at uh Hainan University. Ok. And then as a teaching assistant or something. Yeah. Do you face any discrimination

01:15:43.279 - 01:16:14.000

in when, when you were in Taiwan? Because you are a so called main lender? No. And in Taipei and is very, is Mandarin or oriented the the time. So I remember at that time, we cannot speak Taiwanese. I mean, and the government is a very heavy

01:16:14.330 - 01:16:41.660

handed is no and no, no Taiwanese speaking. And in Taipei, but later on when you move to Taiho did things, did things change not too much. Uh because uh and you know that Don Don University is, is a Christian college and we have our own own

01:16:41.669 - 01:17:06.120

campus everybody and live on the campus. So, so you, you, you really don't have too, too much interaction and with that such general public. Yeah, when you're in uh Springfield, you said that you wanted to move to a bigger city. That's what you told your wife.

01:17:06.200 - 01:17:23.569

Um Why did you choose Houston? Well, because it's so, so funny and she wanted to move to San Francisco. I said no, I don't like San Francisco because I don't like earth earthquake. Yeah. Yeah, because I remember when I was young, like six years old in

01:17:23.580 - 01:17:52.720

Taiwan, I forgot 19 45 1950 I think it's 54 55 to have a big earthquake in Taiwan. And I was very small and it said, I, what that was like uh an in the, in the middle of night and the, the earth is shaking like that.

01:17:53.129 - 01:18:12.569

I said, whoa, so, so, so, so I told my wife said, uh, and then let, let's try Texas because the place because Middle West is cold and you know, win winter time was very cold here. So I found, found a job here. So, hey, so I

01:18:12.580 - 01:18:30.830

come coming down to, to, to Houston. Yeah. What was the first neighborhood that you lived in when you first moved? We uh let's see. And my first job was at the north field and we were at the north west side and my, my first house in

01:18:30.839 - 01:19:03.700

Houston is at uh forest. So at the end of, yeah, so then eighties 89 and we built, we built our own house in the city of so, so now, now we already live in 2024 years. Now, can you describe the demographic composition of your first neighborhood

01:19:05.740 - 01:19:36.810

at that time was pretty good. Well, at the most is uh Caucasian some a Asian then through the years and then then the whole area changed. Now it's mostly black community now there. How about your community in be a is good and is a more mixed

01:19:37.000 - 01:20:09.390

uh and upper up, upper middle class? Community and we got uh very diversified neighbors there and, and the is becoming more professional or oriented community now is doctor lawyers, architects CPA. Yeah. So a school is good. Yeah. Do you remember um the price of your first

01:20:09.399 - 01:20:36.790

house in the North West? This was cheap. I forgot, I think it's like $75,000. Yeah, that, that it was 83. Yeah. How about the house in when we build it? Our cost is like 250,000. And then now I would say about 33 times now. Well, I

01:20:36.799 - 01:20:59.200

would say a minimum about 3 million. Now, did you design it? It's so funny is way and beginning we are not thinking about building for ourselves and we was thinking about the beautiful sale. Uh and after we build, uh my wife said, well, it's not too

01:20:59.209 - 01:21:27.830

bad. So we, we end up living by ourselves. Yeah. And at the time you built uh you built the house in, did you already found sto oh yeah. Yeah. See I found a store in 1983 and I started my house in 1989. So, so, so it's

01:21:27.839 - 01:21:52.709

already 66 years at home with your um family. What language do you speak? Me and my wife that we speak Mandarin and me and my Children and we speak English well, and when my kid, they are young and then I send them to the Chinese school.

01:21:52.720 - 01:22:13.399

So yes, and they can speak. Uh I understand, I understand Chinese. However, now they grow up now I speak Mandarin to them. They will answer in English. So that means is they can understand the Chinese but they cannot uh but they cannot speak as well. Yeah.

01:22:14.529 - 01:22:42.549

Did you make any attempt to uh uh it's so funny. Uh ABC OK. Uh they are young. It's OK. But the go to middle school, high school age, that teen, teen age time and it's, I think they got some confusion of their own identity. So at

01:22:42.560 - 01:23:04.680

that time, they refuse to touch anything related to China Chinese. However, once they go to college and they turn around and they want to learn Chinese uh when my son and actually at UT and he took a two semesters change Chinese course. So he and he,

01:23:04.689 - 01:23:32.919

he can read uh basic writing and all that. And then my daughter can, she can speak Mandarin much better than, than my son. So she, she can handle some basic conversation here. Did your daughter also went to UT? Uh Yes, she, she went to uut two

01:23:32.930 - 01:23:56.850

years then she wanted to major in architecture. So she came back to your age. Then it said she got her undergraduate in your age. Then it said she went to my old old school was so she got, got her master's there. So my son, she uh

01:23:56.859 - 01:24:20.220

well, my son is a story. He and he got a 22 degree he got the bachelor degree in Political Science from U of H. Then he also got the, the, the urban Study degree from UT. Yeah. So, so now that I want my son to run

01:24:20.810 - 01:24:43.089

to run the school, uh the the store, the business side and then my daughter, daughter, she is a good architect. So and let, let, let, let my son handle outside and then my daughter can handle inside your son's degree in urban design. Is it a master's

01:24:43.100 - 01:25:06.810

degree or bachelor's degree? So he spent eight years doing both degrees. He actually spent nine years and it said uh well, you know the boys that they go to UUU and they have good, good time there when my son was stay there, seven years cannot graduate

01:25:07.229 - 01:25:26.379

as a coming home. So he, so he came back to your age. I think he stayed here. I forgot one year or two years and he got the degree in year of age. Then he go back to UT stay there one more year and get uh

01:25:26.390 - 01:25:51.729

and he, he, he's another degree from, from UT. So yeah, so I think that he told to spend maybe 10 years. You got a 222 bachelor degrees. What was the tuition for? Do you remember the tuition for both your Children? What that, what's cheap? I think

01:25:51.740 - 01:26:18.740

it's only like $7000 per year. Yeah, the the public school is cheap, cheap with you. So it wasn't a problem for you financially. You mentioned earlier that your, one of your earliest project was a restaurant. Is it in Houston? Yeah. Yeah. Uh At the, and the

01:26:18.750 - 01:26:40.959

Little York. Yeah. Ok. It said it was in a shop shopping center here. Does it still exist? I think it's, this is 30 years ago. Yeah. Um And you said Houston is an open minded city, a comparable speaking, comparable speaking, I was going to say you

01:26:40.970 - 01:27:06.669

were rejected by secretary so many times. Well, see my, he's so funny. Most intellectual people, they are more open minded, the more lower class people uh and the blue collar people, they are more and the prejudice. Yeah. How did you feel when you got rejected by

01:27:06.680 - 01:27:41.890

all through all those phone calls? Well, at that time, I was not uh I was not uh too much concerned about the prejudice and discrimination and what I'm more concerned, how can I, how can I break the barrier? Ok, then I'm a more forward thinking guy.

01:27:42.319 - 01:28:14.500

OK. If I meet a challenge, I I will focus my energy, how I can solve it rather rather than rather than complain. They, the the example uh recently we are pursuing the Hisd Mandarin Chinese school and the we were the only Chinese architecture in town knows

01:28:14.509 - 01:28:38.100

about the or that and we feel that job is a perfect fit for us and we can create a very unique Chinese environment for students. You know, we lost a job to a big firm. I was surprised and in fact, everybody was surprised. OK, so, and

01:28:38.109 - 01:28:59.649

a lot of people calling me and trying, trying to convince me and they said to protest and complain, I say, I said, and it said, uh my point of view is that is hr SDS loss and that's not my loss. I said, that's a shame. And

01:28:59.660 - 01:29:19.220

when they have somebody lucky enough in Houston has my type of knowledge and experience and they cannot take advantage of it and say, hey, that is HSD students loss is not mine. So yes, I don't complain. I said, forget it. I said I go, would I

01:29:19.229 - 01:29:45.080

go to the lab and next one? Ok. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's a uh as Asian American business in town. We are most of the time. We are in the back of the bus. OK? That is, that is reality because we are not strong enough and

01:29:45.089 - 01:30:14.410

our, we don't have strong political power. OK? And then in order to build that you got to have generations effort that I think is our problem is traditionally Chinese people don't want to involve into the public services, ok? That we always want our kids to be

01:30:14.419 - 01:30:41.770

a doctor, engineers, lawyers at that, they don't want them to get into the political arena. However, in fact, the government is the biggest buyer, the government is a big the client. OK? And if you cannot control, share the public resources and you miss, I was 80%

01:30:41.779 - 01:31:11.459

of the party. OK. So that, so, so that's why. And I told my son, I said, hey, Victor, and you needed to get involved to get and learn how to play the game because most, most Asian politician that's in, well, I doesn't realize the underlying of

01:31:11.470 - 01:31:41.669

the public services is to redistribute the government resource is the contract. OK. Uh uh What you can see every major company in us, every major company they are survived on the government contract. GGN all that and the start were, were like Resler, they start on the

01:31:41.680 - 01:32:15.700

government contract. OK. So an Asian generation, younger generation got to realize in order to advance to help the overall and the Asian population in the future generations, we got to have our brightest evolve into the political process. We need to have more council member, mayor, commissioner,

01:32:15.970 - 01:32:41.140

state rep, senator governors, all that. And we got to have more people on the table and if we don't have it, then they are dividing the pie and we are not in the picture. What's that? That is a reality and you can call it the prejudice

01:32:41.149 - 01:33:04.040

and the old discrimination, whatever the name is, the reality is. If you are not sit on the table, you won't get the piece of the pie. That is a reality. So rather than complaining it, and I think we need to educate our younger Asian American kid

01:33:04.359 - 01:33:33.209

get involved. If you are not involved, you are not a tale. OK. So they very example. Hr SD so far all the contract, all design contract gave to white black Hispanic woman, no Asian and even the Mandarin Chinese school, they give to a wide big firm.

01:33:35.250 - 01:33:59.859

No. OK. OK. Do you want to complain? I just don't care because you don't have political muscle and you can leverage it. So what I would say what I am, the only, what I won't say. I'm only what I would say. I'm the first Asian architects

01:34:00.620 - 01:34:31.100

actively involved into the public arena and it said, trying to shell a small piece of the pie. Ok. What is your political affiliation? Well, well, you can see Governor Bush, Governor Perry was appointed me here at the state of board. So I would say I am

01:34:31.109 - 01:35:03.339

uh liberal Republican uh conservative Democrat. OK. What would I think at the, oh, I think is uh traditionally speaking that the Republican philosophy is similar to, to an Asian philosophy and we wanted to self sustain ourselves and we don't want to rely on the government help.

01:35:03.709 - 01:35:32.490

Ok. So that is uh the underline of the, the Asian philosophy. Mhm. So, however, I don't agree with those extreme and Republican like a tea tea party's approach, I think it's uh I think it's a way to uh to, to, right? Ok. Yes. So we have

01:35:32.500 - 01:36:06.729

to promote self reliance lines, but we have to also help some people is less for fortunate. Ok. So, well, you got to understand the human nature first in order to expand into the so social issues. And we are not uh now because the definition of human

01:36:06.740 - 01:36:37.229

nature is a combination of divine spirituality and the animal instincts, the human society. When you reach to the higher level, you have more spirituality rather than the animal instincts. When you are in a particular situation, your animal instincts will take over. For example, when you are,

01:36:37.240 - 01:37:02.689

when you are in the battlefield and you got to survive when you are in the survival mode, animal instinct and got survive first or you had to, to however, once you are in the higher society and you define spirituality, take, take over. OK. So, so that's

01:37:02.700 - 01:37:29.890

why and in the more advanced society in the more developed society and like the US UK, people are more cultural sophisticated, more polite when you go to go to Nigeria, OK, once or twice is more animal side because people trying to survive. Ok? You see, and,

01:37:29.899 - 01:37:54.910

and those, those people's living condition is just like it's just like a dog seriously. And you talk about value to those, those people that is not your concern, your concerns, they need the food for the next meal, right? So, so, so that's so that's why I

01:37:54.919 - 01:38:23.870

think politically I am a physical conservative. Uh But I also can see the government has certain responsibility to bring up, the less fortunate uh human being or sister brothers up, however, that we got to teach them to be self reliant. Ok. We cannot let them to

01:38:23.879 - 01:38:51.930

be totally relied on the government program either. Ok. Ok. We can help you when you are in, in need and, but we cannot support you forever. Right? So you are not a Republican or Democrat. Well, when I vote, I vote as Republican. You, when did you

01:38:51.939 - 01:39:17.890

become a citizen? Gosh, let me think about it. I think it's 79 or 80. Yeah. Long, long time ago. Yeah. How did you become a citizen? Well, see, and at that time it's easy when you got a masters degree. What I remember I got, gosh, I

01:39:17.899 - 01:39:44.270

got my green card is like uh six months is very fast. Yeah. What, what at that time? Yeah. So if you got the high, high degree, you got it. It's easy. Yeah. Now, and I think that we, and we are see a society need to grow

01:39:44.279 - 01:40:12.810

and you need new idea n new creativity. Yes, you can bring in the lower uh lower and educate the skilled people and society also need needed too. However, you also need the high, higher uh a educated people to, to balance it to, to lead it. Especially

01:40:12.819 - 01:40:57.700

21st century is the power competition century and whoever win is uh where you are and your creativity wouldn't OK? When you talk and rice, who are your students. Most of my student is uh there are professionals, lawyer, doctor, nurses and some others. Ok. And uh and

01:40:57.709 - 01:41:31.890

I found out he is very interesting. Most educated people are interested. Most of female is more interesting and than male. It's strange. Were they mostly Asian? No, actually my class 90% are, are Caucasian. The, and the Asian people, very few, most Asian people are the ABC

01:41:31.899 - 01:41:53.910

S. They are not from Taiwan and China. Well, maybe I think I already know from there. Did you learn it as part of your like curriculum in or did you learn it yourself? Yes. And in fact, 40 years ago when I learned, it's so funny, my

01:41:53.919 - 01:42:22.520

whole intention is I want to criticize Feng. OK, because uh is a very Western nice college and it said we were amazed is a client wanted to have uh the master to review architect design. And we said, gosh, that is ridiculous and why you wanted to

01:42:22.529 - 01:42:52.319

have a superstitious uh aspect. So my whole purpose wanted to to study, to criticize it. However, the more I started it I found out, hey, got Samsung is right. Really is actually is architecture, architecture is the difference between and architecture is architecture also uh also dealing

01:42:52.330 - 01:43:30.799

with invisible dimensions, how the energy flow is a very Chinese. Uh the and the the acupuncture herb medicine and martial art is all dealing with. So yeah, would you call yourself a Confucian? Yes. Yes. And Uh Yes, I am a 90% there. What is that? 10%?

01:43:31.220 - 01:43:54.200

Yeah. Yeah. I think it's really, really, really the great teaching are all saying the truth is only one. You said, you said you believe that there's a master design. Yes, there's a God. Yes. But confusion didn't talk about God. Confusion, talk about heaven. You think about

01:43:54.229 - 01:44:25.229

the thing? Uh It was, I think uh I think Confucius is a very smart person because at that particular time and he doesn't want to evolve into this kind of a religious pursuit, right? So he and the Confucius is a very pragmatic person. He, he more

01:44:25.240 - 01:44:55.529

emphasized in the so social stability and he's more concerned how to give people a peaceful life. And because at that particular time, so he is always at the war. So he, so you know, every religion, every philosophy start at that particular time, particular the environment at

01:44:55.779 - 01:45:20.169

that time, China was in the war and the war, war stage. So he, so he he is more focused on how to help people live better. Uh We will be and rather than search for the high levels meeting. Think about it here, the time, the time

01:45:20.180 - 01:45:53.450

time fare factory here. Do you think Confucianism is a school of philosophy or religion? I think it's more, it's more philosophy, you know, religion is also a kind of philosophy, right? Yeah, you, you are the president of the Feng Shui Institute of Houston. And uh what

01:45:53.459 - 01:46:18.620

is your involvement? What is your, well, when I first taught at the rice 1999 and it said all my students and it said, so we feel that we needed to have a continuing study. So, so we formed that, that group and they said we meet four

01:46:18.629 - 01:46:40.200

times per year. And what, what we do is we have quarterly meeting like second Saturday morning, 10 o'clock, we have a host family and all open up their house or office. So the whole class went there to see the house. Everybody provided their own insight and

01:46:40.209 - 01:47:07.120

we can discuss the issue and we can discuss the potential solutions so everybody can learn. And from, from the real case, I actually wanted to go back to you because I feel like there's more to learn from that. Um So you said that you got a

01:47:07.129 - 01:47:27.930

scholarship from them? And that was how, that's how you decided to go there. Do you remember how much the scholarship was? Gosh, I forgot it. I cannot remember. I think it's like $5000. Yeah, I forgot this e either 2500 or 55 $5000. Yeah, at, at that

01:47:27.939 - 01:47:47.140

time. And that was, that was a pretty good money. Uh Who did you live with or did you live with your wife during that time beginning? And I and I team up with my friend and in the apartment is, then my wife come over I forgot

01:47:47.470 - 01:48:15.439

November and it said we had to move out and we rent a, he's so funny and on the top of a movie theater and is a furnished apartment one room. Ok. And it's the efficiency type furniture, utility paid the month. The monthly rent is 9 $94

01:48:15.450 - 01:48:35.979

per month. Was there an Asian community at Washington University? Uh, very few, very few. Yeah. The friends you team up with, at the beginning with the Asian, right? Are they all from Taiwan? Yeah. Yeah. Yes. And they all are from Taiwan. Yeah. Are you still in

01:48:35.990 - 01:49:01.290

contact with him? Yeah, I still contact with a couple of them and most people graduate and they left. Yeah. Ok. So far I only have two classmates stay in Saint ST Louis and the more most go to New York, San Francisco or Taiwan. How does Saint

01:49:01.299 - 01:49:31.939

Louis compare to Houston ST Louis is a very laid back city, is very old city. It's a, I would say it's very cultural city. Uh, people are polite and, uh, but it's not as aggressive as Houston. My first time I failed. I was different. The first

01:49:31.950 - 01:49:50.140

time is when I was in Springfield, Missouri. Uh, me and my wife go to the shopping mall and we want to buy a drink and we wait in the line and when Juan went down my line, the server doesn't want to serve me and the server

01:49:50.149 - 01:50:14.430

and ask the guy guy behind me said, can I help? And the guy said, he, he's ahead of me then he said, well, what do you want? I said, whoa, I said that it says was, I forgot 78 77 78. I said, whoa. Yeah. So, yeah,

01:50:14.439 - 01:50:40.439

that, that was the first time I failed. And I was, uh, and I was, uh, mis mistreated the very first time. Yeah. Well, what's the ethnicity of the server King? Age? Yeah. How about the people behind you? And why? Why did I do you? Yeah. So

01:50:40.450 - 01:51:00.020

I think it's uh it's really based on how you brought up. OK, if your family is more, more uneducated them and it's uh you will be more open and if you grow up at the blue collar family then and they, they are and the more the

01:51:00.029 - 01:51:36.680

pre prejudice, do you see the Asian network grow in America here? Yes. Yes. Yes. That definitely the growing Asian we are not united so that I'm the first guy and I'm going to put a fundraiser for Male Park reelection campaign uh June 10th and I'm putting,

01:51:37.029 - 01:52:10.299

called the Asian Alliance and I put eight ethnic Asian community together. The Chinese Vietnamese, Korean, Japanese Filipino, Indian, Pakistani. Yes, Bangladesh total eight ethnic group. And we are going to put a function together for male partner, you know, just amaze to me and this is the

01:52:10.310 - 01:52:39.509

first time. Uh we ever have a all the Asian different communities bounded together and even before, is everybody doing their own fundraiser. So, so, so I think the future is we need to have more Asian communities together and it said uh when we can unify our

01:52:39.520 - 01:52:58.990

voice and we have more leverage and we have to learn how we play the game. So with um like starting this Asian alliance and you also like you the president of the Institute and you even send your kids to Chinese school. So you're obviously very involved

01:52:59.000 - 01:53:16.950

in the Asian community here. Um Or did you feel that helped when you first moved to Houston or were you, have you always been involved with this Asian community here? Oh, yeah, yeah, I was, I was the past president of uh Chinese Lions Club. Uh That

01:53:16.959 - 01:53:42.709

was I was uh the family Association's president. I was the past chairman of a Asian Chamber of Commerce and the Asian American Architects engineer group. Uh now that I'm the current president of Houston Chinese Chamber of Commerce. So yes, and I am still involved uh however,

01:53:42.720 - 01:54:11.339

that I like to have a younger generation take over and because uh I think uh it's a time and we should have the second generation pick up the torch here. Oh So when I was looking at the different projects that I had um I saw that

01:54:11.350 - 01:54:26.629

there was the Georgia Run Convention Center, the Hong Kong Super Mall. Um the war which we can see from the rice campus and even the mud lab on our campus. So, um can you tell us just like, what is um maybe a favorite project of yours

01:54:26.640 - 01:54:57.470

or even just a particularly important one to you? Hm. Let me think about it. Did so, so many uh I think uh the most visible one will be that the temple in Chinatown and you know, it's on and the wood uh you know, the, the yellow

01:54:57.479 - 01:55:21.060

roof and it's at the Chinese 10 temple roof that that one. And we did a P face one phase two and it is a very traditional Chinese Chinese design. OK. Then that we did uh that uh now called the Gold Golden Bank. OK. Gold Golden Bank

01:55:21.069 - 01:55:49.189

is uh and uh and the uh that, that one is the first uh uh Chinatown landmark building we designed is to want to create a modern Chinese uh architecture is called the modern Chinese Bank. So, so the building got look modern, got look Chinese, but also

01:55:49.200 - 01:56:18.879

needed to look like a bank. So, so that's, that's a challenging one. George Brown. Yes. And that is a very unique one, uh terminal D and it's at the building, we finished that UFH is uh the, the welcome center. Yeah. What do you do in your

01:56:18.890 - 01:56:42.930

free time? You talk about your professional life. So, yeah, I play golf and I play game. So it right. Yeah. OK. I like to rate and I like to think I try traveling a lot and I can have some solid time and I can have some

01:56:42.979 - 01:57:09.720

meditation time. We actually saw on the website that you did horse painting. Do you still do that? No, I really didn't have too much time. Um, and I was, uh, doing a lot when, when I was young. Younger time. Uh, yes. And I'm pretty, I'm pretty

01:57:09.729 - 01:57:26.270

good on that. That, yeah. Right. Yeah. Uh, did you learn as a child or did you learn in college when I was very young? I, I think when I was like 56 years old and I like to and that uh Dublin and of this sketch or

01:57:26.279 - 01:57:49.189

that I just like, like horses. I don't know why I just uh and for, for me and I got a special attachment to horses. So may maybe in my previous life I was worried or something. Yeah. And going back to architecture and obviously you have experience

01:57:49.200 - 01:58:19.080

with art. Do you see architecture as an art or do you see more as a science? Architecture is more linked to the art part? Yeah. And we are not a rigid science side. Do you have any more questions? Let's see. What is your favorite building anywhere

01:58:19.089 - 01:58:49.589

designed by anyone? Mm That is good question. Uh Actually, when I was in Taiwan, I visit with a building called the Sacred Heart College in and the next to Taipei and it is on a mountain was designed by a very famous architect from Japan called the

01:58:52.709 - 01:59:21.529

what that building is very simple. Building is white white building. However, he really catch it's a light and you know, some famous architects said before, architecture is a machine who catch the light. OK. And uh that, that the beauty is he create a very dramatic space,

01:59:22.310 - 01:59:45.810

is very dark corridor. There at the turn, he create a courtyard, it's very bright and it have a strong con uh contrast. Then he only have one pine tree and in the the courtyard, the white wall is be beautiful space. How about your own project? My

01:59:45.819 - 02:00:15.209

own project. Uh where, where I share the Sorry about that. I forgot your name. Sorry. Oh OK. Victoria. Uh Yes, I would say not yet. OK. I don't think I will have uh my most famous job yet. OK. I think that is coming. Uh However, I

02:00:15.290 - 02:00:41.290

think from the point of view, I would say the temple is good and Golden Bank is good. Yeah, I think so. Is that it? I think we've had Yeah. Very good. So 10th. Thank you for your your time. Yeah. And it does take two hours.