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Alright, um, good afternoon. I’m Anne Chao from Rice University. I’m working with the Houston Asian American Archive and today I’m interviewing a client of Daya.

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Uh, thank you so much for allowing us to interview and share your story with us. Um, can you just start by telling us a little bit about your childhood, um, how you—where you grew up, and what kind of

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family you have? Okay, I was born in India and I grew up in—in the joint family. And I was a good education in India. My family was very supportive to give me an education

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and to be dependent on my own. May I ask, what was your father’s job, or your mother’s job? My mother is a housewife and my father is a businessman. I see. And you mentioned you have siblings, how many siblings do you have?

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Yeah, I do have four siblings. Are they all in India? They all are in India. Okay, did they all receive university education? Yes, they have. So you had a very happy childhood, growing up?

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Yes, I had. Okay. Um, and so when you were in India, did you think that you were coming abroad to— outside of India for any reason?

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At the time, when I graduated and I completed my pharmacy degree, yes, I was um—I was thinking I might go to abroad with the pharmacy degree. I see. Did you think which country you were--

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No, at the time I wasn’t sure which country to go to. I see. And, uh may I ask how you met your husband? We um—I got married by arranged marriage. So basically my parents and my husband’s parents

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were—they knew each other before we got married. Did you know your husband before you got married? Yes, I c—I knew him like a month before we got married. Ah I see. Did you get married in India?

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Yes. I see. And then how long after you got married did you come to Canada? After uh…six months. I see. And in Canada did you start working immediately after you arrived? No, I took exams because I was a pharmacy student (?) in India and

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uh I made a evaluation for my degree. And I accepted my degree so I worked on to get a license rather than working so I wrote technical exams to get the license in Canada.

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Okay. Um, how was the adjustment process, going from India to Canada? It was easy because my husband was very supportive to me. Okay, um did you make friends in Canada?

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We had a lots of friends in Canada. Okay. And why did you move to Houston? Because my husband got a very good job opportunity in Houston. I see. And uh once you arrived in Houston, did you also

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have uh—did you have a group of friends? Were you able to make friends very quickly? Uh…not really. In Houston we didn’t have any—any friends over here,

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when we moved. So, and after—even after we moved, we didn’t have so much—so many friends as we had in Canada. Oh, is there a reason why it was easier for you to make friends in

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Canada than in Houston? Well in Canada because uh I was um… I was going to this—to school and I was writing the exams so I find some friends by myself as a pharmacist.

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But over here I wasn’t really, like, I knew that I cannot work. That could be the reason that I wasn’t… I wasn’t familiar with so many people. Oh I see. Uh, is there a large group of Gujarati uh,

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people in Houston? Or have you found that-- Yes, yes there is. Do you socialize with each other, or?

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Yeah, sometimes when we go to the temple we meet each other. I see. Which temple do you go to? It’s uh Suanai (??) temple. I see. Okay.

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Um, can you tell me a little bit more about your um, experience after moving to Houston from Canada? How different that was from being—Canada, and how different is that—from

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being home in India? Like um…you mean—in Arcadia (?)? Which part of life? Um…maybe we can start with—we know we covered a little bit about the social part.

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Um, what about in terms of uh…I think maybe the social isolation or uh the—you mentioned going to temple and meeting people but that did not seem to be a network that was able to—that

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you can use. [ Yes.] Um maybe you can share some of the thoughts about that – the reason why this is the case. Well in Canada I could say that um…before I came to Canada, we already had some friends…that

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knew—we knew each other from India. So that was the base and like uh—from one friend, came to know other two friends that made a um, big network. Well, in Houston, we didn’t have that base over

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here. So that was difficult to make friends, and uh to make a network. So whatever we have relation when we go to the temple is a kind of formal relation. We don’t have a family—family relation with

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them. I see. Okay. And when did you have you son? My son was born in 2008. 2008. Oh, so he was born in Houston?

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[Yes.] I see. And uh—sometimes, as an immigrant, you can find friends through your children’s school group, and now that your son is four years old-- He’s three years. Three—I see.

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Is he going to any kind of you know nursery school or day care center? He just started. Okay. So maybe perhaps you can eventually have some friends that way? Maybe, yeah, maybe I can make friends now.

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Right. And what do you do, uh, when you’re—when you’re home. What do you do, what do you do normally every day when you’re home? Mmhm. Right now I’m focusing on my study because I—as a

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pharmacist, I can work as a pharmacist in United States but uh for that I need to get a license. So right now I am focusing on to write exams which are a requirement to get the license.

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Okay. Are you going to classes to—to do that? I’m taking sometimes if there is a free classes online, I’m taking classes too. I see. What are—I know that you say you may not remember how much you were paid at your

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first job, but do you remember what your salary was in Canada and what do you think the salary a pharmacist is in the United States at this time? This time like um… if I go in the website for the pharmacy they say the basic salary can be

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between fifty to sixty dollars per hour. Okay. That’s great. Okay, so I guess we move on to, perhaps I can ask you a more personal question. Um, if you would care to let me know why you

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are at Daya, if that is something you can share with us? I can share with you but I don’t feel comfortable to go too deep, too detailed in the case.

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Alright, yeah. Whatever you care to describe would be much appreciated. Okay. So I don’t know, how do I start?

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[laughs] Wherever you’d like to start would be fine. Because I think—I think the important thing about your sharing with us your story is I think that other people who may be in similar situations, that

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they read about your story may be inspired and be able to seek help. I think that would be very instrumental. And not only that…we also want to understand, you know, when a person is in a

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situation like yours, how you can come out and ask for help, and that is also very, very important for people to know. Okay. So for me, as I say, I used to work in Canada as a licensed

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intern pharmacist. But when I— when we moved to United States, I was dependent on my husband’s visa so I could not work in the United States. So at the time I started my career again

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in United States and um… but—before I complete the process, a process to get the license, there was some point um… I feel like um… I’m not

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comfortable and I am being abused by my partner. And at that time I was feeling helpless because I could not work, I was stuck financially. I was stuck to move on my

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career. So I was so confused and I wasn’t able to think what—how should I go, how should I move on? But I am stuck. So during that

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time I was thinking like already one year was passed and I kept thinking what should I do, what should I do? I did not find any socials (?) but luckily one day I found Daya.

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And Daya is helping in this situation where you are—the kind of situation where you are right now. So I called Daya and I told them my story, but I stopped.

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And I was at the right place. Okay, good. Um… Like, in terms of abuse I was abused physically, emotionally, and financially.

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Um, this is after you came to Houston? Yes, after my son was born. Because you were not working? When you were working in Canada it was okay?

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It was okay— [overlapping] Because you were providing for the family-- I wasn’t providing for the family, we both were working, so we both were um…we were—I wasn’t dependent on him, financially…

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So do you think the beginning of this abuse was because you were no longer financially providing something—uh, independent? It’s—I could say it’s a part of it.

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I see. And did you see this coming at all when you were in India, when you got married to him, and you were in Canada, did you realize this was something that was um—this was part of the personality of your husband or this only happened after

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a change of environment to Houston? Yeah it’s only happened after we moved to Houston so I never discovered—I never feel like that is a kind of personality that if I would stop working and then it might change his mind, like

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his personality or his thinking. Do you think the social isolation that you both feel more in Houston might have also contributed to this? It contributed a lot.

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Because in Canada we were living with the friends, so many friends we had, so we always had to get together every weekend. So at one place we had like um…ten, fifteen families we knew each other and we all get together at one place, we enjoyed—and so it’s

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at that time we had really, really good—we had a very good relationship because we were socializing more over there. When we moved to Houston we didn’t have—we didn’t have any social

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network. And that may be part of it. And then having a child might also contribute to a lot of stress because you have responsibility and you’re physically exhausted taking care of the child.

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Yes, that happened because when my child was born my mother-in-law came in United States… to help me but what happened, it wasn’t like helpful to me. Rather it was more frustrating and I was

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exhausted because I had to… um I had to take care of my son, I had to take care of my mother-in-law as well, and I had to take care of my husband, I had to take care of myself too. So I was so exhausted.

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I was expecting help from them; instead they were expecting—to take care of themselves from me. So that was um, kind of so much… I was so frustrated at that time, I was so tired, exhausted.

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And, meanwhile, at that time my husband was so… lose the job. He lost the job during that pace (?). My mother-in-law was here, my son was born. He lost the job so he also had the pressure and I also

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had the… I was physically and emotionally I needed help when my son was born. And you had no friends. I had no friends over here. Were you able to tell any of this to your parents?

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Or you did not want them to know about this? I told them…a few things. Not all things happening in the house. I wasn’t able to tell them because

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I knew that they would not handle the stress because they will think okay—they are not here so they will be more worried about me. I didn’t want them to be worried about me because they already have

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enough things to worry about. May I ask, are you the oldest child in your family? No, I am second oldest. Okay I see.

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So how did you hear about Daya? So one time um…I was being abused physically by my husband. I went to the doctor, I used a walk-in clinic in the CVS, and then I told my story to

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that doctor and doctor knew about Daya and she connected me to Daya from her office. That’s great. So it’s very lucky that you talked to that doctor. [overlapping] It was very lucky day also because I went to that same clinic, I went

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before two or three times when physical abuse was happened. Every time I found there was one—there was other—other doctor was working. He was helping me, but it was a lucky

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day that that lady was there on that day and she knew about all these organizations. She gave me couple of more information about domestic violence and everything.

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But she was very confident about Daya, that she said, “This is the right place that will help you—with your case.” Oh I see. How did you decide to tell your story to the doctor? Because already you were trying to

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keep it into yourself. And you didn’t tell your parents, you didn’t want to worry them. How—what made you decide to confide in the doctor? It was—I was thinking, if I would tell my parents that will not helpful to me

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because what they can do? They can talk to my husband, they can talk to my in-laws, but I already made enough efforts to them and my in-laws to sit with my husband and

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have a discussion what’s going on, but they were not um, they were not listening me. They were not even trying to listen to me, they said no. This is what we are expecting to do from you, you have to do it.

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So there was no point to tell them because they--I thought it will not helpful to me. But if I would tell someone else, like in United States, they might help me because I—my concern was…I was working

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in Canada, I’m a licensed pharmacist in Canada so if I can go back to Canada with my son, my life will be more easier. So that kind of help I

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was seeking even from the doctor, where can I get the information about immigration, if I want to leave the country with my child. And that’s why she recommended me—she connected me to Daya,

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she said, “This is the right place. They will help you with all this kind of concern.” I see. Wow. And how long did it take before you called Daya after you talked to the doctor? Right away.

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She connected me right from her office at the same time. I see. So this was about a year after the abuse began? Yes, almost. Okay. So I hear um, that you know even though you were abused, you have always been very

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confident of your ability. Because you know you have the pharmacist degree and you know that you can make it on your own. It’s just a matter of legal impediments that you were trying to overcome to

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be able to go and free yourself from this situation. So…I don’t know how long you have been with Daya, and are you moving ahead in the process? I’m in lots and lots of process, even in my career.

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So I’m with Daya since January 2011, so it’s more than one year. Almost two years now.

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Will you be able to divorce your husband, or how—? Yeah maybe. Because right now I cannot say more detail in my case about domestic violence because the criminal case is still pending.

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I see. Well, so throughout this process this very difficult year, how did you handle every day? I mean how were you able to get up every day and face another day with your

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husband in this situation? Yeah, that’s very good question that if I look at, back in my past and how would I be able to…get out of the stress every day.

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I don’t know, somewhere I was getting the strength. That’s one of my strengths was okay I can still, well I have my career and I can still be depend—independent of him. I can still be dependent on my own.

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Because I have a—I have a good education. That was my first strength. And then after like um…after I came in contact with Daya, that was my—another strength.

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Okay, I can do whatever I can. So they supported me a lot. That’s great. So once you come into contact with Daya and then you met people who are able to help and support you, did you feel that you now have

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kind of regained the self esteem and the dignity that you had before as a young lady growing up in India? Did you feel like you’re almost back to the same person except for the trouble you still have to, like, sort out?

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Not completely but yes, I can. I’m not fully recovered but I got a lot, I can say. I got a lot. That’s great.

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Um, and— I’m much, much better than I was before. You’re much stronger, the person, right? They gave me strength. That is great. So what do you—what do you see for your future?

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What do you think will—once this, all the legal problems are over, how do you envision your own future? For my future, I really like to work. First thing to get the license and work as a

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pharmacist. Wherever, either in United States or in Canada. Wherever I get opportunity, wherever my destiny takes me. First thing. Second thing, I want to give a very good education to

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make a very good person to my son. And if I will get a very good opportunity then I am still thinking for the study, doing the MD in the medicines.

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That’s great. Do you think of going back to India? At all? No. No? And why is that?

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Because first of all, my son is a US citizen. And second thing, I already have—I already invested my time, my energy, to get a license. I mean like, to make a career in abroad.

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Especially in Canada. It’s the technical exams are very very tough exams compared to United States. So I passed it and I feel

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like I achieved something when I passed all three exams—all three technical exams. Because their result comes like one percent, two percent. So I passed this, I feel like I achieved something. So I don’t want to waste those—my efforts, energy and all

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my time I invested. Right, right. And do you think eventually when all of this is over you will let your parents know what happened to you?

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Right now my parents know almost everything [inaudible]. I see, okay. I don’t know how it works in India, in China we have very similar situations where abusive things happen and sometimes

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I think the two parents—the two sets of the parents will—I mean some of the parents are very nice and you know they try to make things work, very often the parents, the in-laws, will never speak to each other again.

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And I don’t know in your situation what will happen? Yeah in my situation our parents had um…three, four times meeting, they had meeting. At my in- laws’ house.

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But every time they agreed that, okay, this things will never happen again. We will um, will convince my son that we should not do this, this, and this.

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But after meeting is finished, everything will be at the same place, nothing has been changed. So do they admit that their son is physically abusive to you? Do they admit that or do they just

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ignore it? No, they never trusted me (?) they say, “You are lying, do you have”—they will ask, they were questioning me, “Do you have any evidence that he was physically abusing you? You don’t have any evidence, so that means you are lying.” So I was

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telling them, “How can I show you if you are far away from me? If we are living in the same house I can show you, but you are living far away, then how can I show you?” Then—they say—“That

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means you are just lying. “ Wow. Um, do—I guess you don’t know if your father-in-law was abusive to his wife. I mean, is this a family thing?

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I don’t know. Alright. Wow. Well this is a, you know, really powerful story and thank you for sharing with us and I’m so glad that Daya is helping you out.

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Daya, yeah, Daya it’s really really a big help for me. If—sometimes I think if they wouldn’t be there, where would I be right now? That’s a big question in my mind right now, that.

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Right, exactly. So I don’t know if in—at Daya you have met other women in similar situations as yours? And so with the purpose of the archives perhaps people will

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read this story and get inspired. What would you counsel women, or even men, who have found themselves in abusive situations? What would you say to them? Okay. For um… for me I would say that…

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get to the right place. Don’t tell you story everyone who you meet. Make sure you tell your story to the right person, right place. And they will give you lots of

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choices. You are the one, you have to make a choice, whichever is better for your life and your future. And, yeah. Definitely you try your best to make your relationship work. If it doesn’t work, then it’s

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better to come out of the situation. So you think there are people in abusive situations, they will tell their story to everyone? Is that? Sometimes it’s---people are so frustrated, they don’t

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find anyone that can listen their story. They’ll find like… suppose going to the library and “Hi hello” find a friend they don’t know each other very well.

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Even at that time they might tell, “Oh I’m in, I’m really in a bad situation I’m like this, this, and this.” Sometimes that doesn’t help, might make your situation worse.

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Or you are in this situation, you should do this, you should do this. Their advice is some kind of—it’s their opinion, right? Everyone has their opinion.

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That opinion doesn’t work for you, and then what would happen? Their thought and their opinion will stuck in our mind. Will think only in that way. I see.

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And do you advise going to the police at all? Or not-- it’s not necessarily helpful? If needed, yes. If you really really need, then we could seek help from the police too.

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But I think with the police involved then you are, you know, basically tearing the family apart right away because your husband may be incarcerated, or I mean the consequences will not be what you want.

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What you want—yes. But we have—at that time we have to analyze the situation, which one is better? If I don’t call the police then what will be my life? Is this—this abuse will stop without

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involving the police? Then we definitely will not involve the police. But will we feel that it’s not going to stop anyways even if you are seeking help from our families, being (?) all the families, being (?) all

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the friends it’s not working, and if there is no way you could handle the situation, then definitely you need to like, we seek the help from police too. I see, thank you.

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And you mentioned that you counsel women, or men, to try to make the relationship work first. Do you think in your situation, if you found a job, let’s say you are able to work in this country, do you think that situation might have changed?

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Well, yes, that is a possibility. Okay. Has your husband found another job? Now that he’s— I don’t know anything about him because right now we are separated and criminal—criminal

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cases is too pending. So I don’t have any information about him. But it would seem to me that if a marriage depends on the—on your getting a somewhat of an economic resource to bring the family, that is a very tenuous situation to begin with. [It is, it is.]

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Yeah. And any—during any of this time did religion help you? Did you turn to religion trying to seek some comfort or some peace of mind by relying on your faith? Yes, definitely.

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Yeah it’s a very good point. You asked me the question before, that how did you get the strength every day? And you get up and you have to face your husband like he might do

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anything any time he can choose the time he can choose the place, whatever he want to do. At that time the religion, the praying—prayer was my inner friend, as praying. Were you able to go to the temple and seek out the heads of the temple to tell them

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stories? No, no. And what is the reason that you could not trust them or talk to them? No, actually it’s not kind of trust, but… the first thing like we don’t have a car. So wherever we

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need to go we go together because my son was too young so we know, we go—either I need to take a bus or we go together wherever we go. So I wasn’t able to go to the temple every time I needed

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them. So rather I was praying at home. I see, wow. That’s amazing. Well thank you so much for sharing with me and with the archive, your story.

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Um, is there anything else you would like to tell us about? About your life, or your thoughts after this, the whole process, and you know, you never imagine that when you got married

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that this is a situation you will find yourself in. No, I never imagined. And even I never imagined until I was in Canada. But um…the thing started when I came—when we moved to United States.

00:32:19.220 - 00:32:35.100

I never imagined that my life will take this kind of turn. And I have never imagined that. So when you first—when your husband first started abusing you, did he apologize? Did he realize what he was doing?

00:32:35.450 - 00:32:51.600

Yeah, first time—a couple of times he apologized that he was—he agreed that something happened between us and he didn’t say directly that “I will not do this” but he say whatever

00:32:51.660 - 00:33:03.790

happened yesterd—the day after the incidences was happen, he said, “Whatever happened yesterday, it shouldn’t happen again. Either by me or either by you.

00:33:03.950 - 00:33:16.090

It shouldn’t happen—it should not ever happen again.” He said that. But in my life there was a part of um, my in-laws were really

00:33:16.090 - 00:33:33.470

much involved in our relationship. They were expecting that I should stay with my son at their home—my in-laws’ home for uh like, whatever time they ask me, like one year, two year.

00:33:34.750 - 00:33:50.790

And that was difficult to me because I wanted to move on with my career. I didn’t want to separate me and— myself and my son from my husband I didn’t want to, my family being apart for a longer time. So

00:33:50.790 - 00:34:02.990

that’s why I wasn’t convincing for them to stay at their home for a longer time, only me and my son without my husband. Are they in India? They are in India.

00:34:03.600 - 00:34:17.970

And that was difficult for me too. And there was so much involved and every time my husband was so influenced by his parents. Whenever we are I in a good relationship or

00:34:18.430 - 00:34:34.610

conflict is resolved, we are again we are a happy family. And they know that we are living happily because every weekend we talk to them and they can smell, right? They can smell what is going on

00:34:34.610 - 00:34:45.280

between them. If they smell that we are really happy, healthy, really like living, at that point they will bring the same point.

00:34:45.540 - 00:35:00.510

Oh “I still miss Hussie (spelling?)” I mean, my son’s…point out my son was still the little child, we missed them, we wanted to live with them. This kind of making—emotional

00:35:03.060 - 00:35:18.560

blackmailing. So my husband still started thinking about—“but oh you didn’t do this, that’s why my parents are not happy, it’s just because of you.”

00:35:19.890 - 00:35:32.110

Wow. But as this was going on you could see clearly what they were trying to do, that they were trying to manipulate your husband and that they were trying to kind of create some sort of disorder in your family—in your marriage.

00:35:32.110 - 00:35:50.670

Exactly, yes I could see it. But you could not explain that to your husband—he would not understand. He said, “No, my parents are first priority and then you are my second priority. So I don’t want to listen anything for my parents.” That was

00:35:50.670 - 00:36:02.370

his sentence. Wow. That’s very difficult for you. And that’s why it was difficult for me so to whom should I tell my emotions? To whom should I tell my frustration?

00:36:03.200 - 00:36:15.680

My feelings. To whom should I tell? It’s not my parents, I can’t tell to my parents; that’s a different story. And you could not tell your friends in India, your girlfriends

00:36:15.710 - 00:36:25.200

in India, about this. I could tell my friends in Canada. Ah right. I was sharing my story with my friends in Canada.

00:36:26.070 - 00:36:39.470

And did they—what did they say when they hear the story? They say if you want we can talk to your husband and we can have a seat if you want, we can— like, “have a seat” means like on the phone or on internet and chat, we

00:36:40.700 - 00:36:50.850

can—all together. But I knew that if I—if my husband would know that I already shared my story to someone else, that person, he would be very very mad to me.

00:36:52.530 - 00:37:07.650

So I wasn’t… convincing for them. I said no, I don’t want to do that. Wow. Then I can see you were really faced—what they would say is you were caught between a rock and a hard place.

00:37:07.650 - 00:37:19.500

You had no place to turn to except for Daya. [Yes. Exactly.] And so are you much happier now that you are here and being helped by Daya? Yes, Daya is definitely helping me.

00:37:20.490 - 00:37:37.550

But from…I can say from emotionally and all these things, how can I be happier like, you know, this kind of situation? Happy means like, I can make a fake smile if I

00:37:37.740 - 00:37:57.200

go out in the society, I can make fake smile. But from inside, I’m not smiling from inside, because this happening has affected me a lot in my personal life. It has affected me a lot.

00:37:57.660 - 00:38:16.460

Right. Well this is—it is a really catastrophic change in your life and totally unexpected. But I detect you know you’re a very strong person and you’re very intelligent, and I think you’re confidence that—because you are an able person you know that this

00:38:16.460 - 00:38:29.620

is wrong. And that you’re now finally finding Daya to help you, and in the overall scheme of your life, because you’re so young, you have so many more years to go, it will be pass—it will be over and then with

00:38:29.620 - 00:38:42.440

your son and then you will have a good future, but this is a tough time, it’s really a tough time for you. It is. I wish that this time gets over as soon as it can be. Right, exactly.

00:38:42.790 - 00:38:56.350

Exactly. Yeah. And we also had a very, very good time when we were in Canada. My husband was very, very sweet he was very caring for me. And that’s why it makes—like even if from starting we didn’t have

00:38:56.350 - 00:39:12.710

our relationship wasn’t very good, I wouldn’t feel—I wouldn’t feel very bad from now because I would think, “okay, he’s just like that from the beginning.” [Right.] He turned out really—after we

00:39:12.710 - 00:39:26.860

had a really good five years relationship he turned out and that’s why that makes me really cry. I didn’t expect that. Yeah, that’s right. Yeah. Wow.

00:39:26.860 - 00:39:40.800

Well, I wish you luck in your future [Thank you.] and I think with Daya’s help and with your own strength you will pull through. So thank you so much for sharing your story with us, and I think it will help other people who read this.

00:39:41.350 - 00:39:56.340

Yes, I want, I want that it should help other people who are in situations like me, or a situation of domestic abuse, or wherever their life is stuck somewhere. Yes, that’s right. Thank you so much.

00:39:56.360 - 00:40:01.060

Thank you. Well I think I